They forgot Ranged Physical is a role in the game

[Supersnow845]

What free movement? This is a game with incredibly scripted dance routines. Do you think Physical Ranged is running around randomly in circles between mechanics?

In Endwalker, the idea of a Damage Caster existing on a completely different tier from rest of the ranged jobs was just a job-specific quirk of BLM. Now that PCT also occupies the same DPS category while having an overabundance of utility, movement tools, and instant casts (the like of which would make a SMN blush), people are starting to question why that differential treatment exists within ranged jobs.

Again since when has PCT been the catalyst for this

People have been complaining about problems with the physical ranged discrepancy since melees have been playing pseudo physical ranged for 3 expansions now

[Carighan]

Again since when has PCT been the catalyst for this

That's just Lyth, basically she's a bit Cato the Elder and everything has to be about Pictos. :P

[Lyth]

Phys ranged design -- or lack of design, is for a game that does not exist.

This 'free movement' concept that Casters keep extolling as if it's a 'Physical Ranged identity' is actually backhanded slight. Why do you do less damage than Casters? Because 'free movement'. You should be excited to do ranged kiting mechanics. It's not because you're the only one capable of doing such mechanics, though. It's the fact that everyone else's uptime is more important than yours.

And the fact that comparisons of other jobs to 'Physical Ranged' is being used as a derogatory term should cue you in to what people's real views about your role are.

I like the walking casts idea, and I appreciate how your ideas give new skill opportunities to demonstrate equivalence between Physical and Magical Ranged. But let's flip this idea on its head. Casts intrinsically come at the expense of APM. Timed movements come at the expense of reduced mechanical complexity. Difficulty in one area comes as a direct consequence of simplification in another.

Why is what you do considered anywhere less 'skilled' than someone playing at half your APM, especially in an era where the Swiftcast cooldown is reduced and most casts are instant? You don't have to prove that you deserve parity. You deserve parity. And if SE wants players to keep playing the role, then they're going to have to offer a lot more than just a 1% passive raid buff.

[Supersnow845]

Because 'free movement'. You should be excited to do ranged kiting mechanics.

As shocking as it is to imagine some of us actually like to be the one to do this type of mechanic. There were times I requested to be the one to bait the renald because I liked being the ranged player who was taking active part in performing a mechanic

In the nicest way possible your entire post reads like “I can’t imagine anyone wanting to be anything but a melee”, some of us see more complexity in casts than raw APM for the sake of it (VPR says hi who somehow manages to make SMN blush with how simple it is despite having the highest APM in the game). Planning out long casts and organising movement is a more fun method of skill expression than APM to us. I don’t want as many free casts as I’m given. Right now to me the fights and the jobs by extension feel like they are designed to be anti caster but rather than fix this they are just removing casts from the casters, I don’t want that

Physical ranged should be given mechanics that pertain to their strengths; not be shoved down together with the casters for the sake of it

And if we are asking for parity give us parity with the melee, if casters and phys ranged are doing the same damage they should be doing the same damage as the melee

[mallleable]

This 'free movement' concept that Casters keep extolling as if it's a 'Physical Ranged identity' is actually backhanded slight. Why do you do less damage than Casters? Because 'free movement'. You should be excited to do ranged kiting mechanics. It's not because you're the only one capable of doing such mechanics, though. It's the fact that everyone else's uptime is more important than yours.

And the fact that comparisons of other jobs to 'Physical Ranged' is being used as a derogatory term should cue you in to what people's real views about your role are.

I like the walking casts idea, and I appreciate how your ideas give new skill opportunities to demonstrate equivalence between Physical and Magical Ranged. But let's flip this idea on its head. Casts intrinsically come at the expense of APM. Timed movements come at the expense of reduced mechanical complexity. Difficulty in one area comes as a direct consequence of simplification in another.

Why is what you do considered anywhere less 'skilled' than someone playing at half your APM, especially in an era where the Swiftcast cooldown is reduced and most casts are instant? You don't have to prove that you deserve parity. You deserve parity. And if SE wants players to keep playing the role, then they're going to have to offer a lot more than just a 1% passive raid buff.

Tell me about it. I think the whole concept of a 'noob' class or role is toxic, and outdated which is not to be mistaken for beginner friendly design. I actually don't think phy ranged APM would even take that big of a hit even with walking casts if they're implemented well -- in fact, I think it could further enforce the 'aiming' playstyle as players would have to look for the openings in their rotation created by instant weapon skills to fit in those double weaves.

[Valence]

Changing encounters to bring back rphys specific mechanics is good but won't solve the issue on its own. Rphys will never truly be rphys without a battle system that actually cares about different metrics.

Or they could give BRD, MCH, and maybe the future phys ranged walking casts like they have now in PVP, and bump up their firepower from there. Why change 10 dps jobs when you can just make changes to 2-?

Instead of turning casters into rphys, we'll turn rphys into casters.
Either way, with that kind of ideas, we're sure to see both roles finally meet each other somewhere in the middle at some point, and finally merged into the big "ranged" family. How dreary. But that's probably what would make the most sense in the current model without serious changes I'll give you that.

[Connor]

Or instead of making the entire role ‘melee but with slightly longer attack ranges’ they could actually focus on the one unique thing the phys ranged role is actually supposed to bring; party support.

We’re never going to see physical ranged have equalised dps to caster/melee because 2.0 release Coils already happened and the devs were not happy about the Bard stacking lol. So personally I don’t see much value in begging for higher personal dps when we know it’s not going to happen anyway.

They could make an actual effort to clean up the vastly homogenised ‘party support ability’ mechanic in ffxiv, centralise them on phys ranged, distribute smaller scale support to certain caster/melee, add support abilities that are actually interesting and valuable and not just 1000 different versions of ‘increases damage dealt’. Thus reinforcing the intended position the role is supposed to take in the party.

Wanting ‘more personal dps on phys ranged’ is just chasing the dragon if you ask me. Either they equalise with caster/melee and threaten to straight delete those roles, they equalise with caster and have to fight each other for party spots (which caster will likely win because Raise and Pictomancer). Or they increase our damage but at such a small value it doesn’t change how phys ranged actually perform relative to other jobs and thus has literally achieved nothing lol.

There really isn’t any ‘phys ranged get more dps’ option that doesn’t just cause issues. Well…unless they deleted all phys ranged support and utility entirely. But then, sometimes I wonder if that’s not what people actually want lol…

[Oizen]

I wanted to play a phys range but actually do damage so I picked up SMN and PCT

[mallleable]

Or instead of making the entire role ‘melee but with slightly longer attack ranges’ they could actually focus on the one unique thing the phys ranged role is actually supposed to bring; party support.

We’re never going to see physical ranged have equalised dps to caster/melee because 2.0 release Coils already happened and the devs were not happy about the Bard stacking lol. So personally I don’t see much value in begging for higher personal dps when we know it’s not going to happen anyway.

They could make an actual effort to clean up the vastly homogenised ‘party support ability’ mechanic in ffxiv, centralise them on phys ranged, distribute smaller scale support to certain caster/melee, add support abilities that are actually interesting and valuable and not just 1000 different versions of ‘increases damage dealt’. Thus reinforcing the intended position the role is supposed to take in the party.

Wanting ‘more personal dps on phys ranged’ is just chasing the dragon if you ask me. Either they equalise with caster/melee and threaten to straight delete those roles, they equalise with caster and have to fight each other for party spots (which caster will likely win because Raise and Pictomancer). Or they increase our damage but at such a small value it doesn’t change how phys ranged actually perform relative to other jobs and thus has literally achieved nothing lol.

There really isn’t any ‘phys ranged get more dps’ option that doesn’t just cause issues. Well…unless they deleted all phys ranged support and utility entirely. But then, sometimes I wonder if that’s not what people actually want lol…

I genuinely don't understand this mindset. it just seems so defeatist. Every phys ranged's party mit was just buffed, and is arguably the strongest, and most flexible of all the DPS. And yet the role continues to struggle. So instead of nerfing 10 other jobs, just change how 2 or 3 other jobs play (as a MNK enjoyer, you can pry Mantra, and Riddle of Earth from my cold, dead, and bloodied knuckles). Healers are already being encroached upon, and concentrating all the DPS utility onto phys ranged is a surefire why of just replacing healers with phys ranged. It's better that it's spread out.

So just give phys ranged some kind of aiming mechanic so they have better control over their damage output, and balance them against the other roles -- y'know, coz like they're DPS or something. MCH should be balanced against SAM, BLM, and VPR as a non buffing job, and BRD should be balanced against like MNK, and PCT as buffing jobs with utility, and no rez. It's not hard to imagine.

[NightHour]

is SMN a physical range job?

It's a better one.