Dawntrail Dragoon Feedback

[Aco505]

I'm not saying every job needs to be super complex but the devs seem to be on a holy mission to make every job as mindless and lacking in any sort of failure state as humanly possible.

The worst part is that it wasn't even complex in EW. LotD was streamlined in full uptime fights compared to ShB, leaving actual management and thought a thing when specific types and amounts of downtime were involved.

Now that the core aspect of LotD doesn't require management, it shows how fundamental the eyes were for the feel and game play of the job, even if we could argue that 7.0 didn't radically change any other parts of the kit.

[Carighan]

Now that the core aspect of LotD doesn't require management, it shows how fundamental the eyes were for the feel and game play of the job, even if we could argue that 7.0 didn't radically change any other parts of the kit.

I would actually use that to argue the exact opposite, it shows how utterly useless they were since clearly we can see now they added nothing of substance, we just all somehow got so used to how utterly insubstantial Dragoon as a job is that we took the thin veneer of design as something to latch onto.

With it gone, at least we all agree the job needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. Then again so do all melee DPS because the game as a whole does not want jobs to have a unique identity, and at 6 melee jobs, we need that! Desperately. Jobs need to be better or worse in different situations because they need to be different. They cannot be perfectly balanced, if, say, Dragoon had double the melee reach as a unique thing or so. Or even better, actually gets worse if standing too close. We use a lance, you don't use that in knife-range!

[Supersnow845]

I would actually use that to argue the exact opposite, it shows how utterly useless they were since clearly we can see now they added nothing of substance, we just all somehow got so used to how utterly insubstantial Dragoon as a job is that we took the thin veneer of design as something to latch onto.

With it gone, at least we all agree the job needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. Then again so do all melee DPS because the game as a whole does not want jobs to have a unique identity, and at 6 melee jobs, we need that! Desperately. Jobs need to be better or worse in different situations because they need to be different. They cannot be perfectly balanced, if, say, Dragoon had double the melee reach as a unique thing or so. Or even better, actually gets worse if standing too close. We use a lance, you don't use that in knife-range!

Can you imagine if the melees were actually given the variety that the casters have, hell the melees can barely shut up about PCT and BLM being “allowed” to do as much damage as the melees, giving that sorta internal variety to the melees themselves would cause a full blown meltdown

[Aco505]

I would actually use that to argue the exact opposite, it shows how utterly useless they were since clearly we can see now they added nothing of substance, we just all somehow got so used to how utterly insubstantial Dragoon as a job is that we took the thin veneer of design as something to latch onto.

Spoken like someone who has never played the job at high end. One of the big skills related to DRG was knowing when to delay, rush or do a double LotD window.

The core problem was that an important system was removed and nothing was given back. For instance, you could've kept EW BLM as is but with Enochian removed and you would've had a very similar situation: the job would "play the same" but the loss of Enochian management would hurt it more than anything by removing nuance and a fundamental cog from it.

[Birdbrain]

Those clips of the attack animations are helpful to see. Often I feel like I'm going crazy, because among all the various, valid issues people have with their favorite classes, some of my biggest peeves with Dragoon are animations/sounds or the 'feel' of it. I feel like an ultra-giga nitpicker for not even wanting to level up my Dragoon more since the expansion dropped. This thread feels a little bit validating and it's nice to see others feel similar about some Dragoony changes.

I really hate the new Drakesbane move =P It sounds like somebody tearing into a piece of cardboard, or coughing and clearing their throat. Oddly deep, murky, and 'blunt' sounding for a spear attack. It sounds especially bad coming after the crisp, sharp sounds of a Wheeling Thrust or Fang and Claw.

The animation is a bunch of spastic, flashy flailing too and 'weightlessness' is a good way to phrase it. If the hit sounds don't match up with the animations I wouldn't be surprised at all. I compare it to Chaos Thrust, which is a rather flashy animation too but does it all right. It communicates every animation hit with clear, sharp sounds (one two, pause, three!), culminating in that final attack, and feels and looks great. Drakesbane is a bunch of audio and animation noise clattering together with very little cohesive style.

Disembowel is such a wonderful animation, love watching that one over and over. It has amazing sound design too, the brief silence and wind-up before that final thrust. They knew what they were doing with that one to give it oomph.

I might be the only one in the world who dislikes Drakesbane so much, but with the removal of the awesome Spineshatter dive and replacing it with a lame ground slide, my enthusiasm for my main class's "feel" has broken a bit. Also lost Plunge on my DK and got another dumb slide replacement, so I am doubly bitter! Dragon Sight was a bit clumsy to use, but thematically it was great to have-- looked cooler than Lance Charge too. I enjoyed the class flavor of waking up the dragon's gaze with Mirage Dive too. I wish I could have optimism that devs might fix or rescind on some of their class choices this expansion, but...

[CidHeiral]

I might be the only one in the world who dislikes Drakesbane so much, but with the removal of the awesome Spineshatter dive and replacing it with a lame ground slide, my enthusiasm for my main class's "feel" has broken a bit. Also lost Plunge on my DK and got another dumb slide replacement, so I am doubly bitter! Dragon Sight was a bit clumsy to use, but thematically it was great to have-- looked cooler than Lance Charge too. I enjoyed the class flavor of waking up the dragon's gaze with Mirage Dive too. I wish I could have optimism that devs might fix or rescind on some of their class choices this expansion, but...

They definitely dropped the ball hard with DRG this expansion. It's hard to believe whoever came up with these changes plays the job at all or understands on any level what made it fun to play and enjoyable to look at.

[Carighan]

but with the removal of the awesome Spineshatter dive and replacing it with a lame ground slide

Other people are seemingly much more easy to please than I am. >.>

I mean, don't get me wrong, Dragoonslide is terrible in looks (feel hardly matters, it's a gapcloser, it closes the gap). But honestly? Spineshatter was no better. We're comparing 0/10 to 0/10, but orange-flavor instead of strawberry.

[CidHeiral]

Spineshatter Dive looks fine to me. I always found it visually satisfying to gap close with, and certainly infinitely more so than the goofy slide it was replaced with.

[CidHeiral]

tl;dr on the 7.1 DRG changes:

- Various potency buffs.

- Using Elusive Jump gives you enhanced Piercing Talon damage.

- Starcross is 20 yalms.

- Nastrond charges reduced to one. (?????)


Fixing the Starcross range while dumbing the job down even further. You're too generous SE, truly.

[Balmung_Griffin]

Low level burst and AoE rotation are definitely less fun with those changes.