(genuinely. not sarcastically) Who is the 24 Man Savage For?

[Themarvin]

FFXIV Team currently is not happy for their main player base and has not been so for years now, sure I did the RP and Venues part of the game as well.. but there is no world content and all areas from ARR to EW is dead empty and without purpose as no lvl100 content in them at all, no world content at all....

It is kind of sad that showing up with new ultimates, Unreal and 'Savage' 24 man raid, it seems really being out of touch with the game from a development point of view like as in bigger is better, but litterally not having a way to live in the game... and nope limited jobs is not cutting it either and I do not get why there is not being done anymore for for the actual jobs to do content with inside the game at level 100.

You could litterally have 2 instances anyone zone, one for leveling up and the other for max level characters... and on top on that, stop adding more levels per expansion, but improving and adding more content to the game instead, base higher end content on item level instead, and synch down to item level 590 for any areas before DT.
Treasure maps should take one anywhere in the game as well, there is too much re-use and trash old areas in this game that you may as well just cut it all away and let all start from Shadow Bringers or something and delete everything else in the process.

[VerdeLuck]

I'd suggest there simply isn't a wide audience (majority within the playerbase) that wants to attack content requiring Discord coordination and multi-statics.

Definitely would say the same. I'd be wiling to give the harder content a go but the fact it's going to be discord required and it's effectively going to be a group who has cleared 100 times handing me a set of guides and dictating everything I do to make sure I can't possibly fail seems like it's not even fun.
That's where the BA and DRS fights are and at that point it doesn't even seem fun, it's basically just a free carry from people taking a bunch of rewards off the top.

Requiring me to go into a discord, give a bunch of personal info to a bot for marketing purposes, unprivate all my lodestone info, and sit through a lecture in Voice Chat before I can push any buttons is not my idea of a fun time in FFXIV.

Besides I can't believe people will use these as any kind of measuring stick for skill when they seem like they'll be super on-rails after the first few weeks, when guides come out and everyone is required to use them before they zone in.

[mallleable]

I do think there is a growing demand for non raiding combat gameplay from both raiders, and non-raiders. Like yeah, Chaotic might end being a super fun romp, but it still requires players to be removed from MMO spaces, and get stuffed into a box to fight something. I would love love love for them to give things like FATEs or hunts more attention, and care, and make them not cheesy, not boring or a miserable nightmare to do.

[Kaurhz]

It has been highly requested at points in time, like people have wanted savage alliance raids for a while.

I'm glad those people got it.. Personally, I always feel a bit edged about this sort of content because generally I don't feel like content like this can sustain itself too well outside of externally organizing via Discord, such as is the case generally with BA and DRS. Innately that's not a bad thing, but if it's the sole thing that ends up keeping the content alive..

I do think those resources would be better spent elsewhere, but alas, some people wanted it.

On the note of the focus on hard content. I don't think it's innately a bad idea as it does give people to strive for, but they're doing this bizarre thing where currently those on casual or midcore content are essentially getting less-than-breadcrumbs for more than the first half of the expansion until they actually elect to release exploratory content. This content should be frontloaded.

They do really need to rethink their structure of content and schedule of said content.

[OgruMogru]

It has been highly requested at points in time, like people have wanted savage alliance raids for a while.

I've been quite vocal about wanting savage or some form of higher difficulty 24 man content but of course the monkey's paw has curled up and punched me square on the nose because I certainly did NOT want another single boss encounter with no build up, no environment and yet again unclear and illogical caveats [its for 24 but you need 12?? what??] Just like criterion savage in regards to healing limitations, and eureka and bozja large scale content also having stupid conditions and fail states that makes organizing people even more of a hassle than it should be. I was just hoping for an unreal version of the alliance raids that would essentially allow people to experience the raids properly synched and with a full kit, not to be thrown into a THIRD iteration of Cloud of Darkness with zero foreplay.

[Nezerius]

Since I don't know japanese, I'll relay what I read on the live letter translation on the Balance:

"About difficulty
They wanted to try to get it to be around Extreme difficulty
But they also want more people to try out this new content, so they have balanced it around Savage 2nd floor
(Extreme difficulty is supposed to be between floors 2 and 3)
They think it'll be the right balance for people who cleared Savage but not really in the mood for Ultimates"

So perhaps they mistranslated? Where did you get your version?

Either way, said to be above 2nd floors of savages is no joke compared to what was advertised initially.

The translation on the reddit discord seems a bit different:

"Y "We wanted to match Extreme difficulty at first... but I would say the mechanics themselves are like the first floor of savage, but when you consider doing it as 24 people, it might bump up to the level of a second savage floor""

This one definitely implies that extreme fights are easier than savage. With the fight being mechanically similar to the first Savage floor, and the amount of players potentially increasing it to the second Savage floor when it comes to difficulty.

[Gurgeh]

Definitely would say the same. I'd be wiling to give the harder content a go but the fact it's going to be discord required and it's effectively going to be a group who has cleared 100 times handing me a set of guides and dictating everything I do to make sure I can't possibly fail seems like it's not even fun.
That's where the BA and DRS fights are and at that point it doesn't even seem fun, it's basically just a free carry from people taking a bunch of rewards off the top.
...

This. Yeah I'm just not joining discords for this or any content to be honest. If its super old content that has a mount I really want, and I barely want to do the content anyway then maybe (although so far I just cant be boethered with BA for this very discord reason). If discord and the like is needed, then SQX needs to start officially hosting a directory for stuff like this under the community finder, I just don't do that redit-4-chan shit. Me I'm not interested in rewards unless its gear for other content. This kind of thing is all well ang good if your the sort of player that just sprints Variant on day 0 with a guide to get their mount, but thats not me.

The only way I can bear to do Extreemes is by putting up PF for blind prog, doing that a couple of times until hit about half phase 2, and from then on I dont't mind using a guide because the fight it mostly repeat mechanics sort of.
But I doubt that is going to work for 24 party content. As it is I wonder if I'll be doing the next Extremes, because I'm not rushing back to re-sub, and by the time I'm there I doubt I'll fill a blind PF. And I really don't enjoy the business of revising guides. I take it too seriously and its NOT FUN. I have zero interest in mounts, so why am there now after having ruined the encounter with a guide.

Like I've said I don't expect them to make content just for me, but that sort of thing definitely isn't for me.

... I certainly did NOT want another single boss encounter with no build up, no environment and yet again unclear and illogical caveats ...

! ...
!! ...
!!! ...

WTF!? So this is not a 24 player raid, its a 24 player trial? If its a single boss encounter thats what it is. Yeah I can say for a fact I've got no interest in that. Like I said, being unsubbed, missing the opporunity for blind prog of Extreemes, I wonder if I'll even have done those. So I won't need this unless I can blind it.

The gatekeeping that could arise with PFs in this could be awful, as making your own arrangements could be hard.

I'm really hoping we are all jumping the gun, and we've got this all wrong. I think that will be the case to a very large extent.
But with the way the game is SQX really needs to be a bit more reactive and louder with their PR.

[SylvAlternate]

Me and I'm going to enjoy it on Christmas Eve instead of being with my family

[Akonyl]

I'm one of the people looking forward to it, but who knows if/when I'll do it. I was hoping it'd be released with 7.1 so I'd have a chance to do it before ultimate, but with it releasing the day before Christmas, oof. All the people I know will probably be too burned out with their ultimate prog at that point to want to do 24man raid prog at that point.

[VeyaAkemi]

This. Yeah I'm just not joining discords for this or any content to be honest. If its super old content that has a mount I really want, and I barely want to do the content anyway then maybe (although so far I just cant be boethered with BA for this very discord reason).

It should be noted that the reason things like BA and DRS require Discord coordination is because death in those environments is extremely punishing, normal rez spells don't work there, BA requiring Sacrifice L and DRS requiring Lost Arise or Lost Sacrifice, you can absolutely get DRS prog parties and I have been part of a few though I have yet to clear DRS(mostly due to lacking time to prog it), but BA would be extremely difficult to prog due to its nature, and the fact you can only go inside once every half hour at best due to reliance on Ovni spawns, assuming Chaotic raids are simply normal raids with a fat player count, and so you can just join them freely through DF, the same requirement won't exist, and while more difficult to organize simply due to numbers, you should be able to PF it just fine.

And personally, even with the heavy degree of organization, I find BA to be an absolute blast, if anything I wish the game had more content like it, BA and DRS are already very close to an Extreme/Savage-level Alliance Raid, not quite for a number of reasons, but it hits all sorts of similar beats, and it affected me such that when I first did BA, I went through a weird phase of spending two weeks doing nothing but joining every BA run I could find, once 4 times in a single day.