Is it reasonably possible to clear savage without Synced Burst windows?

[Saraide]

I don't understand the argument that syncing burst windows makes PFing harder. It is commonly understood that you press your raid buff on GCD 3, with some exceptions by class, and some exceptions by fight. If there is confusion you can simply say "gcd 2 or 3 for burst?" and then you know. After the first buff comes out gcd 3 every other buff comes out exactly on cooldown.

You dont understand the argument because it is pure gibberish dreamed up by someone who has not the slightest clue about savage. It reads like someone is looking like a fool in a discord arguement and is stretching for backup.

[Gurgeh]

You dont understand the argument because it is pure gibberish dreamed up by someone who has not the slightest clue about savage. It reads like someone is looking like a fool in a discord arguement and is stretching for backup.

This is the second moody message you've posted. Why are you so upset.
Ask a lala to give you a hug.
Or stop banging your head against PF, what ever it is that's got your 2Bs in a twist.

Also no. No one is discussing the actual XIV game in discords. I'm not exaggerating. Perhaps another reason why I'm here.

It's a fair point and does take some explanation. As I've already said I have no idea about savage, and frankly this is showing me I'm missing nothing. It doesn't really sound like a 'game' and I've no interest in mounts.
But I hear nothing but how absolutely hopeless PF is fit savage. So I wondered if it was because synced buff windows are harder if not a static with tight openers on voice. But I don't expect that's a reason either. My original post is one huge I don't know, question?

[Gurgeh]

I don't understand the argument that syncing burst windows makes PFing harder. It is commonly understood that you press your raid buff on GCD 3, with some exceptions by class, and some exceptions by fight. If there is confusion you can simply say "gcd 2 or 3 for burst?" and then you know. After the first buff comes out gcd 3 every other buff comes out exactly on cooldown.

I'd played this game for four years and I'm not 100% sure we are taking about the same buff. We're not talking about tinctures now are we? No I dint think so.

As for 2/3... all the people I enjoyed playing with will be WAY more or of sync than just one or two GCDs after a single rotation. Most will be doing a 90% (only) proper rotation they worked out for themselves and that's just in a normal trial or Expert roul. I myself refuse to make the effort to make gap closer part of my rotation. I tried it for a bit and the job just got irritating and flat. It was just me and boss following our own independent scripts.
If we wipe engage because I dropped some gap closers so save them up then game is taking piss.

I'm still not clear on if Synced party Buffs, and people timing their bursts to those, are two separate discussions?
I had assumed you time your raid buff to yourself and that's it. Maybe you stay in sync maybe you don't.
(And this is why to me PF send extra challenging. How the heck do you get back in sync with no voice, a shit blowing up everywhere)

[Kohashi]

It pretty much depends on what gear the party is sporting and the fight itself. If everyone is in crafted gear and the collective damage is just barely enough to pass the enrage, then no. You have to coordinate and play your job effectively enough to go past it.

The current tier is not really that bad. You can clear with multiple deaths which also implies that an out-of-synch burst is also possible.

[Raraka]

I'm still not clear on if Synced party Buffs, and people timing their bursts to those, are two separate discussions?
I had assumed you time your raid buff to yourself and that's it. Maybe you stay in sync maybe you don't.

You dont sync party buffs for the sake of using them at the same time, they just all happen to be on a 2 minute cooldown, so by using them after 2 or 3 gcds into the fight, and then every time the cooldown is ready, you are maximizing how many times you use the buff in the fight, and by proxy, you will stay in sync with the rest of the party

This is why some people love/hate the 2 minute window meta, since everything syncs around this 2 min timer, using your hard hitting moves while you have multiple buffs makes a huge spike in your damage

On the flipside, you also have the reason why people hate it so much. If you die, or your cooldowns missalign with the 2 minute burst, then thats it, you damage is gonna be a lot lower for the rest of the fight. Even if you hold your hard hitting cooldowns to sync back into the 2 minute burst, you will be losing 1 or 2 uses in a normal fight, or in some cases its borderline imposible to sync back because your rotation dies when you go down (looking at you summoner)

So to recap, if you are playing well enough to do savage or extremes, you use your buff everytime its ready to get the most uses of it, and by proxy, the 2 minute meta happens

And this is why to me PF send extra challenging. How the heck do you get back in sync with no voice, a shit blowing up everywhere

This is why people in PF either do a clean pull for the clear or "wall it" because their buffs are missaligned, people died, etc. They can practice freely and fuck up many times, but for a clear pull, ideally you would want it as clean as posible, or wall it if things go south and try again

[Saraide]

I'd played this game for four years and I'm not 100% sure we are taking about the same buff. We're not talking about tinctures now are we? No I dint think so.

As for 2/3... all the people I enjoyed playing with will be WAY more or of sync than just one or two GCDs after a single rotation. Most will be doing a 90% (only) proper rotation they worked out for themselves and that's just in a normal trial or Expert roul. I myself refuse to make the effort to make gap closer part of my rotation. I tried it for a bit and the job just got irritating and flat. It was just me and boss following our own independent scripts.
If we wipe engage because I dropped some gap closers so save them up then game is taking piss.

I'm still not clear on if Synced party Buffs, and people timing their bursts to those, are two separate discussions?
I had assumed you time your raid buff to yourself and that's it. Maybe you stay in sync maybe you don't.
(And this is why to me PF send extra challenging. How the heck do you get back in sync with no voice, a shit blowing up everywhere)

Do you know what a cooldown is? Are you aware that most buff abilities have a cooldown of 2 minutes?

[Raraka]

Do you know what a cooldown is? Are you aware that most buff abilities have a cooldown of 2 minutes?

Dont be a meanie~ ;³; ♡

But for context, back in my day- (not really), buffs used to have more mixed timers, 90s, 180s, etc. So you would have 2 (or 3) important windows in a fight. The burst at the start where everyone was on sync, and at 6 minutes when things lined back up

People complained that it was hard to work around these timings (mostly pleople who didnt want to put the effort), so all buffs got shifted into 2 minute cooldowns

On the 60/90/180s buffs era, say, machinist or samurai could burn some spare gauge along the way, tactically planing to use it when their allies used their buffs along the fight. And in this era, those who enjoy min maxing were on either 2 sides

Side 1) Cool, optimization is fun, I can find these spaces to put my cooldowns to squeeze more power out of them!

Side 2) I cant play my job because they are only using 60s and 180s buffs, I hate this (This is an exageration, they could still play it but it wouldnt be as effective*)

AND THEN GOD AND SAVIOUR, MOGSTATION SWEEPED IN AND SAID:

"My child, your prayers have been answered, now every buff is 2 mins in cooldown"

And so, the magic 0 and 6 minutes bust windows became the norm every 2 minutes, making it less special, and since it was the new standard, it also made it a lot more unforgiving if you were to die during it, or get missaligned from it too much, as damage was tuned around this damage spikes

[Bellybell]

I'd say..

If you play the job PROPERLY you can still reasonably cleared it
but by properly playing, the burst sync won't be differing by much for each jobs, 2-3 gcds misalign or maybe 4 at most

If you can comprehend what's its mean by properly that is

[Gurgeh]

... back into the 2 minute burst, you will be losing 1 or 2 uses in a normal fight, or in some cases its borderline imposible to sync back because your rotation dies when you go down (looking at you summoner)...
... This is why people in PF either do a clean pull for the clear or "wall it" because their buffs are missaligned, people died, etc. They can practice freely and fuck up many times, but for a clear pull, ideally you would want it as clean as posible, or wall it if things go south and try again...

Lots of slightly but significantly different takes.

Not really relevant to this discussion. But I'm pretty confident that Savage is not for me. I'm not interested in mounts. I'm frankly not interested in clearing, just in fun progging, and that would irritate the hell out of me. I'd have to leave after the second "wall it". I'd enjoy it with the right friends wit the same goals as me, but PF just... how does that sound like fun to anyone.

Over all it still sounds like the 2 min synced buff thing needs to go.

[Gurgeh]

...

• Synchronized burst windows do cause some of the homogenization and this was made worse in EW with the alignment of burst windows to 1 or 2 minute intervals. The easy solution, in my opinion, would be removing raid-wide damage buffs altogether and making damage buffs not multiplicative, so that job design isn't constrained as much.

...

I think I'm most for this actually. Scrap raidwide buffs for most jobs. No raid/party buffs on any Mele. None on Dancer, (make that a partner buf). Keep them on BRD, but make them POWERFULL. Maybe throw some on Healers and one of the DpS mages (poor BLMs need some TLC). I'm sure healers wouldn't object. As things stand their damage comes down to about 2 buttons, and sure as heck their healing in the casual game is futile. Keep raidwide mitties as they are.

...
I don't know that the fights were designed to be synchronized particularly in the past, because players that synchronized and optimized everything found DPS checks overly trivial compared to regular players (at least from what I used to see hardcore statics say). But now that they are synchronized by design, they can scale the content accordingly (but the first raid tier, which we're currently on, is usually more lax in all respects)...
...
The burst windows being synchronized in EW was obviously meant to make casual players do what hardcore statics were doing already, without realizing it, so that the DPS checks weren't easier for those synchronizing them...

If all of this has happened just to be able to make one phase of fights harder for the top 10% of the top 15% then that just tragically stupid.
I'm frankly irritated by the talk of 24 man savage, because I couldn't even get enough interest in criterion. And I've no interest is Savage after reading much of this. We are screaming for more content (apparently), the only content in the game at the moment that is still being played is Savage which doesn't work for so many people, and 24mans are where they want to spend their dev time?!

I'm conscious of the fact that I should definitely try Savage for myself. But my sticking around would depend of much what's been said here not being true in reality. That said, I'm not much motivated by anything other that finding out the reality for myself. Not the gameplay (because honestly I'm not a fan of the fact that these fights instant wipe unless you know them ahead of time studied one chosen stat, they are quite literally impossible from the pull without foresight even if you were a problem solving savant with reflexes of a tennis player and the dexterity of concert pianist) , not the mounts, hopefully it is more sociable than people walling every time they think they are not going to clear this time.