WXHB long-term carpal tunnel

[Darkstride]

As someone who agrees macros aren't the best for all the reasons listed: why do you care?

I agree with the "why do you care" part. However, I think it is irresponsible for someone to give advice to use macros as part of your basic rotation and act as though there is no possible drawback or disadvantage.

[faiarrow]

As a controller user with pretty severe arthritis in my left hand: please for the love of the gods put all your *CORE* skills on your main crossbar. So many of the jobs have had their buttons condensed that it can be very easily done.

WXHB is great for additional things, I do have a few main buttons on Black Mage for example on my WXHB but they're things I'll only be using at certain points: leylines, xenoglossy, flare star, etc. My CORE rotation buttons are all on the main crossbar. GNB I also have set up similarly, core on main crossbar, additional in-situ skills (usually cooldowns) and toggles (ie tank stance) are on the WXHB because I'm not expecting to be hitting them all the time/only as needed for trash pulls or TBs.

I'm really curious to what your crossbar set up is to have to so heavily rely on the WXHB for your core rotations? Because that sounds like it's genuinely poorly mapped...

As others have suggested, also look into controllers with digital triggers (Switch, for example), or invest in something with paddle-toggles for L2/R2 (what I use, has substantially helped with managing my hand pain which is from well before I got into XIV so my goal is to not make it worse) which will reduce the strain of trigger tapping, and remember to stretch and actually take breaks.

[Doomfist]

I stopped using WXHB for my second hotbar, the double tapping was both finicky and tiring to do. Now the only combat actions on my WXHB are sprint and limit break, since all jobs use those, while the rest is just menu buttons and mounts.

Instead I use the expanded hold crossbar (LT + RT and RT + LT) for combat and just remember which "side" has which actions, like my aoe on all jobs are on RT + LT face buttons. I wish SE implements a way to see our expanded hold crossbar instead of the WXHB, currently I add a cosmetic hotbar below my main crossbar, in order to track cooldowns of my expanded hold actions and which "side" they're on.

[Erit]

I see a lot of people providing alternatives, but not taking into consideration OP's original idea. Why do we even need to to double tap an input when there are other buttons available on the controller that can handle it in a single press? Currently, the shoulder buttons are used for hotbar switching (an outdated thing you shouldn't be using in combat), autorun, and for tab targeting in conjunction with the triggers. I would personally be fine all of those inputs were instead moved to double presses as they are either not necessary or don't come up as often. I feel like the game should at least allow for more customization for changing controller layouts. It just seems like they want to simplify anything related to consoles as much as possible to the player's detriment, even if playing on PC.

Seconded. Limiting cycling hotbars to when you are in the action assignment state would make it impossible to fat-finger swap mid-fight. If I had a nickel for every time I accidentally Kasha'd instead of Jinpu'd because of that, I'd have a dollar; not a lot considering how long Samurai's been around, but it's incredibly tilting every time.

Presently the WXHB is where I stick defensive cooldowns with longer durations, potions, ready check/countdown/waymarks, LB and my mount catalogue. And Dissipation, on Scholar. Still have a few slots unused on most jobs.

[TalithaSolarien]

I stopped using WXHB for my second hotbar, the double tapping was both finicky and tiring to do. Now the only combat actions on my WXHB are sprint and limit break, since all jobs use those, while the rest is just menu buttons and mounts.

Instead I use the expanded hold crossbar (LT + RT and RT + LT) for combat and just remember which "side" has which actions, like my aoe on all jobs are on RT + LT face buttons. I wish SE implements a way to see our expanded hold crossbar instead of the WXHB, currently I add a cosmetic hotbar below my main crossbar, in order to track cooldowns of my expanded hold actions and which "side" they're on.

Same here, I only use the WXHB for ternary mostly stuff that I use rarely (like mounting, teleport, etc). The really important skills that don't fit on the mainbar are in the expanded hotbar (using the same cosmetic hotbars for tracking). SE, please add a way to show the expanded crossbars for visual tracking.
For AOE skills I have a completely separate crossbar.

[Collin_Sky]

why do you care?

When someone goes around promoting flawed advice, like claiming they've "debunked" the issue of macros not queuing properly by adding something as simple as /ac "be lazy" <me> to every empty line, it's harmful to the playerbase as a whole. This kind of advice can spread, causing more players to adopt inefficient and problematic practices. By suggesting that a simple tweak can solve these issues, it ignores the real and well-documented challenges players face when using macros in battle content.

Moreover, the idea of lumping all mitigation abilities into a single "mitigation button" is particularly concerning, regardless of whether queuing is an issue or not. Mitigation in this game often requires timing and situational awareness. By cramming all these abilities into one macro, a player loses the flexibility to respond appropriately to the specific needs of a given situation. This not only risks wasting cooldowns but also diminishes the player's ability to learn and understand the nuances of their class and role. Regardless of whether queuing is an issue, this approach fundamentally misunderstands how mitigation should be handled in both casual and high-level play.

It's important to recognize that giving out advice, especially in a public forum, carries a certain responsibility. Encouraging others to adopt practices that are suboptimal or downright harmful can lead to a broader decline in the overall quality of gameplay within the community. This isn’t just about one person using a bad macro; it’s about the ripple effect that can occur when others see this advice and assume it must be effective.

[LilimoLimomo]

I agree with the "why do you care" part. However, I think it is irresponsible for someone to give advice to use macros as part of your basic rotation and act as though there is no possible drawback or disadvantage.

I agree, it would be irresponsible to act is if there are no possible drawbacks or disadvantages to macros.

That said, there's no honest way to read through this thread and come away with the idea that I'm "acting as though there is no possible drawback or disadvantages" to macros; to do so, you would have had to miss every single one of these that I wrote:

"take advantage of their strengths while avoiding common pitfalls."

"most macros will have 0 waste, while a handful will have 1 or 2 lines of waste."

"So in a 20-minute fight the world's most perfect player might lose a whopping 4 actions."

"Only one macro can be running at a time."

"Even using all 15 frames, a macro will generally have a shorter queue window than a normal action; so if you wanted to weave with a button that's a macro, you might need to space your press out a bit more."

"If you write a bad macro, you're going to have a bad time. If you mash a macro that shouldn't be mashed, you're going to have a bad time. Try to get a macro to do something it can't really do? Gonna have a bad time. "

"Yeah, broadly speaking I recommend against writing macros that chain GCD skills with /wait commands, as it's nearly inevitable that such a macro will meaningfully clip the GCD (or simply not function)."

To top it off, my in-depth guide I've linked in multiple posts throughout this thread spends multiple paragraphs going over the cons of macros in detail: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-or-Lost-Casts

To suggest that I'm acting as if macros have no drawbacks is simply dishonest.

[gllt]

Encouraging others to adopt practices that are suboptimal or downright harmful can lead to a broader decline in the overall quality of gameplay within the community. This isn’t just about one person using a bad macro; it’s about the ripple effect that can occur when others see this advice and assume it must be effective.

Well, all I take away from this is that you care a lot about your community and that's really nice. Carry on. Good luck with your endeavors.

[LilimoLimomo]

By suggesting that a simple tweak can solve these issues, it ignores the real and well-documented challenges players face when using macros in battle content.

I haven't just suggested that a simple tweak can solve these issues, I've demonstrated it. That said, if you're aware of other issues that this doesn't solve, why not actually tangibly present them? If there's data that suggests my tests are flawed, or if there are problems that it doesn't address, share the data with me.

I want people to be able to safely, comfortably, and effectively play the game, and because of that I'm going to keep spreading the most accurate information I have on macros. If you think there's misinformation in what I'm saying, the best thing you can do is to provide me with sound evidence. These forums contain numerous examples of someone presenting compelling evidence and me graciously updating my perspective, even on topics such as macros. Wherever the evidence I have leads, that's where I'll go.

Moreover, the idea of lumping all mitigation abilities into a single "mitigation button" is particularly concerning, regardless of whether queuing is an issue or not. Mitigation in this game often requires timing and situational awareness. By cramming all these abilities into one macro, a player loses the flexibility to respond appropriately to the specific needs of a given situation. This not only risks wasting cooldowns but also diminishes the player's ability to learn and understand the nuances of their class and role. Regardless of whether queuing is an issue, this approach fundamentally misunderstands how mitigation should be handled in both casual and high-level play.

First off, let me correct something that you misunderstood: I don't put all mitigation abilities in a single button. As I said, I put "generic mitigation" abilities in a single button. Rampart and Sentinel. The difference between these two abilities is so minor that it has never mattered in my play. If it would matter in yours, then your needs are different than mine, and by all means I encourage you not to use such a macro.

In addition, it sounds like you've lost touch with what casual play of FF14 requires, because it generally requires very little. In casual content I've healed plenty of tanks who didn't use any mitigation, and outside of wall-to-wall pulls it doesn't even matter.

[Mikoko_Miko]

I am a controller + trackball player. My WXHB is mainly an indicator of oGCD actions. I assigned L3 button (left analog stick press) to execute macro for swap XHBs.

I found a youtube video which compares raw actions and macros. Macro's GCD loss is only 0.083 sec in 3 min. I'm certain that well-written macros don't lead to significant loss.
https://youtu.be/sns_9GhUTqU