Dawntrail vs. Stormblood? [possible spoilers]

[KooriGraywolf]

I am having a hard time deciding in my mind whether I place Stormblood or Dawntrail higher (granted, we've still got Dawntrail patches pending). I might also be forgetting too much about Stormblood, or have Dawntrail too fresh in my mind. So help me make up my mind?

I do have some pointers:

Dawntrail pros:

• Overall premise is more interesting, personally. I could not care about Ala Mhigans and revolution/patriotic themes do not speak to me. The rite of succession and the subsequent twists seemed more compelling
• Zones/dungeons and their themes are way more interesting
• Mamool Ja lore reveal was a genuinely good writing moment
• Music is more bangin'

Dawntrail cons:

• Wuk Lamat mentioning peace every 5 seconds and getting way too much spotlight
• The activities in the zones were way too formulaic. Reaching literally every zone was "ok, let's get to know the locals". Stormblood at least had a more fluid and unpredictable sequence of events
• Barely any dark/gritty/philosophical writing moments, which we've come to expect after the last 2 stories
• Despite the FF9 nods, I expected more direct references, and the use of FF9 music felt forced at times
• The WoL was extremely unimportant to the story. We contributed nothing. I only got that feeling back when I started the Arcadion
• The high stakes at the end also felt too forced in. I know we need stakes but do we again need something world-ending? (by comparison, Heavensward was very grounded/contained and yet it's my favorite story in the whole game. I hoped for something like that)
• Despite the cool Mamool Ja reveal, how can the story try to force us to be sympathetic towards Bakool Ja Ja right away? I understand the need to win, but doing things like insulting Wuk Lamat have nothing to do with that

I am undecided whether I prefer Wuk Lamat over Lyse. If we removed the excessive obsession with peace, Wuk Lamat could've had a MUCH better personally, but alas we do have that and again the excessive spotlight time did not help.

Another good point to Stormblood, it gave us Sadu and Cirina (who I also really liked)

Am I forgetting anything?

[Carin-Eri]

Hate to say it, but I feel it's too soon to judge.

Dawntrail's release was less than a month ago and has only had it's .0 patch storyline + the first four raids. By all accounts the Raids seem pretty popular. The general opinion of Stormblood was that it's post-patch content wound up being the past part of it, so my opinion of Dawntrail comes down to "lets wait and see".

[KooriGraywolf]

Hate to say it, but I feel it's too soon to judge.

Dawntrail's release was less than a month ago and has only had it's .0 patch storyline + the first four raids. By all accounts the Raids seem pretty popular. The general opinion of Stormblood was that it's post-patch content wound up being the past part of it, so my opinion of Dawntrail comes down to "lets wait and see".

Yeah, you're probably right. However, my current judgment is also based on only the base story of Stormblood, not including the patches

[koko-on-da-forumz]

I'll say that I love the Stormblood MSQ, despite its faults. But I'm also a Zenos fangirl, so.

On the other hand, I started skipping cutscenes out of boredom in Dawntrail.

We also know in hindsight that Stormblood's patch cycles were top tier. The jobs were fun, Eureka kept the community active (and the community was smaller, closer-knit, and not so....horny and pathetic?), Omega is imo the perfect difficulty for Savage, introduction of UCOB, Blue Mage, actual relics, it was a great time to play.

Dawntrail has a lot of time left, but I've unsubbed at least until the new exploration zone launches. We'll see how it goes.

[Kaurhz]

Wuk vs Lyse is a conflicting one for me, to be honest - But I would say if they didn't force Wuk into the spotlight too much, then I would comfortably take Wuk over Lyse. - From what I remember Lyse wasn't suffocatingly present, but she was just downright annoying.

Honestly though, I don't even think it matters which one was better or which one was worse. Both of them were not good, at all. Story-wise.

Comparing content is pointless seeing how new this expansion is.

[Zackneifein]

If we talk strictly about the x.0 MSQ, I think the main difference between SB and DT are :

• Lyse isn't overpresent, we have multiple time to ourself or for other characters without Lyse being either here or being the subject (Gosetsu treatment in the Azim Stepp by itself is far better than Erenville and Krile rushed (and quite insulting) parts with Wuk Lamat head that could be seen on the background). Wuk Lamat is everything, everywhere even when she isn't here.
• The WoL has massive agency and importance in the story : the battle for Ala Migho is also the battle for Eorzea, the Scions have a immense debt to Yugiri and the WoL is the ONLY one that can stop Zenos. In DT, we have close to no agency before the very last moments of the MSQ and everything else could have be done by any elite adventurer. For those who will say "They told us it would be low stake", first they lied, second just wanting to explore things and meet people by yourself can be agency too (like we were promised and that's what Estinien is doing) but following blindly a character that you are forced to love by proxy of your character without question isn't having agency, it's having a job. And for those who will say "our agency is that we are Wuk Lamat's mentor" we just aren't, and it's easy to explain how.
  We have far more agency in the Arcadion with all the "You can do things without relying on souls" and that we will probably be the one starting to make the Alexandrian change their mind about the use of souls (on a bigger scale that just some individuals).
• The antagonists are "meh", Bakool Ja Ja redemption is FAR too easy and quick, Yotsuyu and Fordola took a full much more too barely grasp redemption (even in death). Let's not forget that he basically threw a nuke on Tuliyollal. Zenos is what Zoraal Ja wished he was and Sphene is the only good point for me, even more when she still wanted to do her genocidal route after being brought back by Wuk Lamat.
• Too much unvoice dialogs, too little solo duties for our WoL to shine a little.

For the rest :

• Most of the fights (dungeon & trials) are better and Omega is one the same level as Arcadion for me, which is great.
• Music are on par, even if I personnaly dislike the ending theme song of DT, it's still good in it's own style I guess.
• The zones are definitly better, but I don't like Stormblood one except the Azim Stepp. And as much as I love Kugane, even more for it's density but two beautiful city are better than just one even if marvelous.

[Lohen]

MSQ-wise, Dawntrail was the weakest expansion for me, however, I still had a good experience going through it.

[Havenchild]

Dawntrail MSQ is better than Stormblood both story and pacing. While not by much, can say I remember snoring through the entirety of the SB MSQ only picking up when Zenos was present while with DT, the beginning is more if a slog /snorefest but the second half was way better imo.

Wuk Lamat is also better than Yda/Lyse as a character although really they are both two halves of the same coin. While Lyse rushed headfirst into things and similarly failed and had learning curve moments, Wuk Lamat hasn't really been tested, but she's also taken her time to understand the cultures and issues of each group of people so imo, it still makes sense she hits less roadbumps.

As for who is more annoying, imo, still think that goes to Lyse. They both are naive in alot of ways but I dislike more someone who is naive and doesn't take the time to learn. For me, it also never made sense why Lyse became the prominent leader of Ala Mhigo versus Raubhan, where premise wise it makes alot more sense why Wuk Lamat is a leader of her people. Raubhan immediately garnered respect among his people the moment he landed there.

DT could have did better with both Zoraal Ja and Sphene as antagonists and both were rushed. Zenos is better done in EW for sure but in SB he is immediately established as a threat as he clowns both WoL & Scions two seperate times.

Battle wise, encounter design is seemingly peak for both for their respective time periods.

Music wise, DT has a better soundtrack but poorer sound quality on all the ENG VA's at random moments.

Artwise - DT blows SB out the water in nearly ever zone.

[Nothv13]

Wuk Lamat is far worse than Lyse for the simple fact she was never really tested and simple talks could change the minds of people with centuries worth of xenophobic cult like behavior on top of being the goal of quests objectives 139 times (Talk with Wuk Lamat). Its to the point that we don't get to see Krile's initial reaction to her revelation because we must follow Wuk around. Hell even our adventure with Erenville is largely focused on Wuk with the bracelet. To think a character that fails and grows and changes is worse than a character that succeeds at everything they do and is the focus of the story even when they are not around to the detriment of other characters developing is absurd.

[Willemdarke]

It's too soon to tell, as SB's best moments (like the story leading to Tsukuyimi) were all in the post-patches.

So far I prefer:
*Wuk Wuk to Lyse (random tonberry NPC #17 would be better than Lyse)
*Tural's worldbuilding to both Ala Mhigo and the far east.
*Tural's zones to anything in SB
*Yotsuyu to Mecha Mewtwo
*Zenos to Queen Spleen
*SB's pacing and stakes to DT's
*SB's themes to DT's
*SB's MSQ ending to DT's

Let's see how the patches go, but after the great ShB and EW, I'm underwhelmed.