Omicrons and The Endless (Do Endless Dream of Electric Sheep?)

[Turtledeluxe]

Ah yes, we didn't have time to consider alternative solutions to the endless or discuss the moral implications of what we were about to do.

We didn't have time. Sphene was making calculations to begin enacting her plan. Did you even play the game???

Wuk Lamat: Even if we cannot be friends right now, we need to find a different path forward. A way that Tuliyollal and Alexandria can coexist.

Sphene: I fear that can never be. There is no other path for us. It's too late.

Alisae: Hear me, Sphene . We appreciate your commitment to serving the Alexandrians and have endeavored to understand your beliefs. Be that as it may, you must know it is wrong to sacrifice our living to save your dead.

Sphene: For them I will do anything. No price is too high. if bloodshed will save my subjects, I will become history's most brutal Queen.

Reading is important.

Sphene was not interested in alternative solutions.

[SongOfTheWind]

We didn't have time. Sphene was making calculations to begin enacting her plan. Did you even play the game???

Sphene was not interested in alternative solutions.

And why do we care if she was interested or not? Us defeating her has nothing to do with the fate of the Living Memory. She didn’t even notice we shut down it already. The question of why we were doing it before confronting her was never answered.

[Turtledeluxe]

And why do we care if she was interested or not? Us defeating her has nothing to do with the fate of the Living Memory. She didn’t even notice we shut down it already. The question of why we were doing it before confronting her was never answered.

That's called bad writing. You're clearly admitting here that you expected characters to have foreknowledge that turning off the terminals would result in bad writing where the writers forgot to have Sphene even address it.

This is why your take is so pretentious and annoying. You are not the characters and you didn't write the story.

The "why" is clearly answered. You are ignoring the intentions because it is inconvenient for your argument.

[SongOfTheWind]

That's called bad writing. You're clearly admitting here that you expected characters to have foreknowledge that turning off the terminals would result in bad writing where the writers forgot to have Sphene even address it.

This is why your take is so pretentious and annoying. You are not the characters and you didn't write the story.

The "why" is clearly answered. You are ignoring the intentions because it is inconvenient for your argument.

So, I wonder then if you yourself played the game. As the characters are asking why they have to do it while the objective is Sphene and the answer there is a dismissive “just do it” which they for some reason accept.
But given your tone - don’t bother to answer, you are clearly not fit to have a discussion so enjoy my ignore list.

[Turtledeluxe]

So, I wonder then if you yourself played the game. As the characters are asking why they have to do it while the objective is Sphene and the answer there is a dismissive “just do it” which they for some reason accept.
But given your tone - don’t bother to answer, you are clearly not fit to have a discussion so enjoy my ignore list.

I have. I can read too.

Cahciua: I want you to erase us. Erase the Endless.

Cahciua: Being alive, you are the only ones who can do this. And you won't have a better opportunity while Sphene is busy preparing...

Wuk: It's wrong to sacrifice others to sustain the Endless. This I firmly believe. But talking to you now, you seem as real as of us. If you need an answer right away, I donf know if I can give it. Is there a reason to act so soon?

Cahciua: Because as you've just said, It's wrong to sacrifice others to sustain us. Remember, we need life force. Other forms of aether do not cut it.

Erenville: but does it need to be done now? Can't we stop Sphene and then do this?

Cahciua: It is precisely in order to stop Sphene that it must be done now. Her own memories are stored within the Meso Terminal. Once we are gone, Sphene will have no reason to plunder other worlds of aether.


It's all in the game.

Sphene not acknowledging is just bad writing and doesn't alter their intentions or points whatsoever.

We certainly had time to do several quests, take a gondola ride, buy some ice cream and take a quiz....

This is also just bad writing. It doesn't change the fact the intentions behind turning off the terminals are sound and occurred prior to Sphene finishing her calculations (which was the goal).

[Vyrerus]

So, I wonder then if you yourself played the game. As the characters are asking why they have to do it while the objective is Sphene and the answer there is a dismissive “just do it” which they for some reason accept.
But given your tone - don’t bother to answer, you are clearly not fit to have a discussion so enjoy my ignore list.

THe reason we "had to" or "should" was that it would slow down the calculations of the Meso Terminal/Sphene *might* give up doing it when there's no one to protect.

But what's funny is that, what would the Interdimensional Fusion have achieved? It would have fused Living Memory to the top of Everkeep like it was supposed to be... which I guess would have given her direct control of Everkeep's Robot army, but it wasn't even an instant win for her. She still would have had to fight us, and would have had to fight us in the real world, not just in the computer generated portions of the Meso Terminal like we did.

DT ending has some interesting bits, but it's a big piss colored mess.

[ElHeggunte]

And why do we care if she was interested or not? Us defeating her has nothing to do with the fate of the Living Memory. She didn’t even notice we shut down it already. The question of why we were doing it before confronting her was never answered.

Because we were trying to find a peaceful solution first? The first thing we did upon arriving was confront her and ask her to stop until we could figure out a solution that would benefit all parties. She said "piss off, kupo" and started purging the memories that made her even remotely reasonable before initiating the countdown to her plan, leaving us little time for anything else. Because remember, the entire reason this topic keeps coming up is because some players are upset that we "killed" the Endless without bothering to find a solution, completely ignoring the fact that we did try, were immediately rebuffed, and then put on a strict timer where the only solution really available to us was to alt+F4 the Endless.

Us defeating her had everything to do with the fate of Living Memory and the Endless. There was no way to stop her without "killing" the Endless at the same time. Sphene was sustained by the Meso Terminal. The Meso Terminal in turn ran everything else in the Living Memory. The Endless were going to "die" no matter what we did. Hell, even if we rolled over and let Sphene have her way, the Endless were on borrowed time anyway. The whole point of contention is the system was unsustainable and the twisted reasoning of her programming wouldn't allow her to see it or care. Even when Wuk Lamat managed to Talk no Jutsu her personality back, Sphene doubled down on her position.

She didn't notice at first, because as the story points out, she was busy with the calculations required to put her plan into action.

And they did mention why we chose the route of shutting down the Terminals first. First and foremost, the idea was hedging the bet that if Endless no longer existed, Sphene would abandon her goal. Unfortunately she didn't. Second, there was a fear that immediately attacking her directly would possibly force her to accelerate her timetable, giving us even less time to stop her.



Whatever. You folks are welcome to die on the hill that the Endless are alive and that we "genocided" them without making an effort to save them. That's you asserting your headcanon over what the game explicitly tells us about the situation, but you're free to reject that reality and substitute it with your own.

[Turtledeluxe]

Because we were trying to find a peaceful solution first? The first thing we did upon arriving was confront her and ask her to stop until we could figure out a solution that would benefit all parties. She said "piss off, kupo" and started purging the memories that made her even remotely reasonable before initiating the countdown to her plan, leaving us little time for anything else. Because remember, the entire reason this topic keeps coming up is because some players are upset that we "killed" the Endless without bothering to find a solution, completely ignoring the fact that we did try, were immediately rebuffed, and then put on a strict timer where the only solution really available to us was to alt+F4 the Endless.

Us defeating her had everything to do with the fate of Living Memory and the Endless. There was no way to stop her without "killing" the Endless at the same time. Sphene was sustained by the Meso Terminal. The Meso Terminal in turn ran everything else in the Living Memory. The Endless were going to "die" no matter what we did. Hell, even if we rolled over and let Sphene have her way, the Endless were on borrowed time anyway. The whole point of contention is the system was unsustainable and the twisted reasoning of her programming wouldn't allow her to see it or care. Even when Wuk Lamat managed to Talk no Jutsu her personality back, Sphene doubled down on her position.

She didn't notice at first, because as the story points out, she was busy with the calculations required to put her plan into action.

And they did mention why we chose the route of shutting down the Terminals first. First and foremost, the idea was hedging the bet that if Endless no longer existed, Sphene would abandon her goal. Unfortunately she didn't. Second, there was a fear that immediately attacking her directly would possibly force her to accelerate her timetable, giving us even less time to stop her.



Whatever. You folks are welcome to die on the hill that the Endless are alive and that we "genocided" them without making an effort to save them. That's you asserting your headcanon over what the game explicitly tells us about the situation, but you're free to reject that reality and substitute it with your own.

The characters in the game distinguish the difference between alive and dead. Cahciua is an Endless and establishes it quite directly. Sphene admits in dialogue that her perception of the Endless as living is simply based on being remembered. I wasn't aware that in the game or reality, we qualified being remembered as being alive.

She doesn't even refer to it as killing. She refers to it as erasure. They're literally data.


And just being able to still do new things doesn't change the fact that they are a data based instance of the original human soul.

[ChrysOCE]

We didn't have time. Sphene was making calculations to begin enacting her plan. Did you even play the game???[/B]

We certainly had time to do several quests, take a gondola ride, buy some ice cream and take a quiz....