Dawntrail character graphics update - opinions, requests and discussion megathread

[Einnecy]

I really didn't want to say it but the only thing that is worse is Thancred's skin texture that looks like acné and it's not noticeable here. (I reported it as a bug, so that probably will be fixed, it's the only skin texture looking different). The rest are the same and perfect so I don't see your issues. It's called mostly ilumination you know?

Fair point, though if it truly is only the lighting they still look different and are thus affected. At least that's what I think.
To add another example, an NPC which actually has an entirely unique face unlike Urianger and Thancred, Ryne looks very much like herself.

[juicybug]

i made a thread that was quickly buried, but I hope it fits within this!

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...87#post6531487

But basically TLDR: The character customization after the update really drives home how far behind the creator & options available are atm.
Before anyone jumps saying that it's fine as is, just take a quick read if it's not too much trouble!

One thing I've noticed is the characters (the males) really have no complexion & are very pallid. No flush, no lip color, no real detail to their skin what-so-ever. Like, look at the ff12 models & compare them to the characters now.
The 12 models still look a bit better than they do in XIV bc of they were given shadows & highlights on their skin without the use of ingame light, even though they were graphically limited. I don't see why they can't have the same sort of skin coloring/style. It would help in game models a lot.

[lunartears]

Fair point, though if it truly is only the lighting they still look different and are thus affected. At least that's what I think.

Apologies for chiming in, but I found these two sticking out to me when I was playing the MSQ.

Here's what I noticed:

- Thancred's lips are flatter (except for the bottom lip which is notably more plump)
- Thancred's upper lip is thinner
- Thancred's lip corners are downturned and wider (bottom lip looks more detached from the corners)
- Thancred's eyebrows are darker (but his hair is brighter?)
- Thancred's irises are positioned slightly higher (he looks a little scary)
- Urianger's eye colour is darker (new eye texture)
- Urianger's bottom lip is thinner
- Urianger's eyelids look less defined
- Both of their eyes look bigger but not sure if that's my own eyes playing tricks on me

On the other hand, NPCs with unique faces mostly look the same.

[Turnintino]

Fair point, though if it truly is only the lighting they still look different and are thus affected. At least that's what I think.
To add another example, an NPC which actually has an entirely unique face unlike Urianger and Thancred, Ryne looks very much like herself.

At first glance, I don't think she's been updated extensively. At most, it looks like they might have increased the resolution of her hair texture and nothing else. They most certainly haven't touched her face mesh, which looks just as low poly as before -- or her normal map, which looks just as flat. But I believe the devs have said that past unique NPCs would not be high priority, so I'm not really surprised. Ryne, in particular, doesn't call for it as much as, say, an NPC like Varis, who has all the facial nuance and articulation of an ARR-era Primal. So, it may be a while before we can start using these characters as basis for comparison.

[Einnecy]

At first glance, I don't think she's been updated extensively. At most, it looks like they might have increased the resolution of her hair texture and nothing else. They most certainly haven't touched her face mesh, which looks just as low poly as before -- or her normal map, which looks just as flat. But I believe the devs have said that past unique NPCs would not be high priority, so I'm not really surprised. Ryne, in particular, doesn't call for it as much as, say, an NPC like Varis, who has all the facial nuance and articulation of an ARR-era Primal. So, it may be a while before we can start using these characters as basis for comparison.

Aye, that's basically why I am sending these comparisons to begin with. Whereas small tweaks would have sufficed, the changes on the NPCs are noticeable and they are pretty bad.

Apologies for chiming in, but I found these two sticking out to me when I was playing the MSQ.Here's what I noticed:<snip>

Thanks for taking the time to write this out! I appreciate it a lot because I had intended to edit in the differences I have observed with the NPCs but sleep deprivation is kicking in pretty hard and I don't wanna mess too much up. Besides Urianger's missing eyebags, I struggle to pinpoint what exactly is going on with the eyes and why it bothers me so much but all I can say for sure is that it doesn't quite look like them, even if you change the lighting.

[Turnintino]

Aye, that's basically why I am sending these comparisons to begin with. Whereas small tweaks would have sufficed, the changes on the NPCs are noticeable and they are pretty bad.

Yeah, I certainly would've been happy with no more than upscaled diffuse maps and maybe tweaked normals (a lot of the issues people have pointed out about things like misaligned lower lip lighting were just as bad if not worse before the update, almost entirely owed to weird normal maps), without touching the models at all. Completely overhauling the models like they have would be fine if it meant more nuanced customization options (which I believe is at least theoretically possible now, based on the techniques they've alleged to use), but that isn't what we got, and they've announced no intention to change that, so we have no choice but to beg them to make adjustments. It's a lose/lose situation where so many of us are unhappy and the devs have more work to do, when they might've gotten away with doing much less to begin with lol.

[Eien713]

Eyes are one of the worst "upgrades." Ryne looks dead inside or zoned out in the second pic. I also can't stand the weird light between the lips for all characters, NPCs or not. It's so jarring and unnatural.

[Jassie]

I tried to like my character's new look, I really tried, but after playing for two weeks I still can't come to like the way he looks now. My main issues are the new thinner and lighter eyebrows and the eyes. I prefer thicker and bushier eyebrows and these are the thickest option this face has, but now these too are really thin and look like they're pointed way more upwards than before.

His catlike pupils are barely showing most of the time and they look more like dots than slits now. I chose a sunseeker miqo'te BECAUSE of the catlike eyes, but now they are gone. The eyes also used to look like they were shining in most enviroments (kinda like the ancients' eyes, but milder), but now that effect is also mostly lost. The mouth also looks worse, but that is a much smaller problem to me than the eyes/eyebrows, kinda just wish that we could turn down the glossiness of the lips.

[GreenLeafy]

I tried to like my character's new look, I really tried, but after playing for two weeks I still can't come to like the way he looks now. My main issues are the new thinner and lighter eyebrows and the eyes. I prefer thicker and bushier eyebrows and these are the thickest option this face has, but now these too are really thin and look like they're pointed way more upwards than before.

His catlike pupils are barely showing most of the time and they look more like dots than slits now. I chose a sunseeker miqo'te BECAUSE of the catlike eyes, but now they are gone. The eyes also used to look like they were shining in most enviroments (kinda like the ancients' eyes, but milder), but now that effect is also mostly lost. The mouth also looks worse, but that is a much smaller problem to me than the eyes/eyebrows, kinda just wish that we could turn down the glossiness of the lips.

I feel much the same. I miss my old look. I miss my golden cat eyes aswell. I cannot stand the new look for them and I went through the entire MSQ with sunglasses because of it. Like you said it was a racial trait for Sunseekers and one which drew me to them and I wish it got as much attention as the Moonkeeper fangs...
Mouth animations feel so much worse , my eyebrows are also thinner, lips super glossy in random scenes just ugh. I miss my miqo so so bad, what a shit way to have to part ways after 9 years. And just any dev good will has been crushed since they haven't bothered at all to address any of the concerns put forth in forums in many , many threads even since benchmark releases.

[Khryseis_Astra]

I made this gif to add it to that post and you can clearly see the difference in the eyes and in lips and eyebrows too.

I really don't understand what they were thinking making so many unnecessary changes... And I'm pretty annoyed they've addressed the issue with the housing lighting but not a word about our characters' faces.

I’m glad they’re working on the housing issue, because it’s just as bad, but I agree they should’ve prioritized the characters! What players were expecting were more hi-res versions of their characters, not essentially digital plastic surgery that changed the actual shape of facial features.

In particular, they called out mouth scaling as an early problem, and it’s unclear whether so many of the issues we’re seeing fall under that already addressed error… did they make changes between Benchmark 2 and release? (Possibly, because my Hyur didn’t look as bad there as she does in game.) If they didn’t, maybe it’s on a hopefully high priority to-do list. If they did try to fix it, they failed, so it needs to be redone. So many characters look like their top lips have been reduced to the point that their expressions and emotes look totally different.

What hasn’t been called out by the devs yet is a similar issue with the eyes changing shape on most races. (Not to mention the color and luminosity!) You don’t really notice it as much on certain races until they do emotes. I had thought they fixed it on Lalas at first until I looked at my portraits. At least my Lala still looks “close enough” to before, I’m just sad I can’t use certain poses or emotes anymore because they look off. But my Highlander was totally destroyed…

I wish they’d at least address this again now that we’ve had the characters in game for a couple weeks, we’ve pointed out all the various issues, and we’ve shown that these are things the free Fantasia can’t fix.