Dawntrail character graphics update - opinions, requests and discussion megathread

[NaokiMiakoda]

I really HATE!! the graphic update.

now the chars look lifeless/soulless and like bored (sorry) s*x dolls.

the male chars look like they didn't sleep for weeks and smoked weed (did you see the BIG eye bags especially at elezen and male hyuran faces?!)

no character look like before (in a bad way!!). its not about shades, etc.... the SHAPE of eyes and lips were changed!
so the chars became something you NEVER would have created...

since the update I didn't log into the game, neither renewed my abo payment...

[Feathetaria]

I really HATE!! the graphic update.

now the chars look lifeless/soulless and like bored (sorry) s*x dolls.

the male chars look like they didn't sleep for weeks and smoked weed (did you see the BIG eye bags especially at elezen and male hyuran faces?!)

no character look like before (in a bad way!!). its not about shades, etc.... the SHAPE of eyes and lips were changed!
so the chars became something you NEVER would have created...

since the update I didn't log into the game, neither renewed my abo payment...

I 100% Agree. My Female Miqo'te is sad about her own existence atm and is just hoping she can get back to her old self eventually, but she's trying to not get her hopes up.

[Iscah]

That is because the game had an old and busted lighting solution falling on old and busted models. You're going to see shadows where there may not have been shadows previously because they are now being simulated properly.

Being "old" doesn't automatically make it "busted" or the new version better. I'd say they busted the models in the update.

Even if the old shadows were "faked", that ultimately means they were placed where a human artist believed the shadows should sit on the character, and it becomes an integral part of how the character is supposed to look.

Additionally, it's not just a matter of new lighting on the same faces. The face structures have been changed, some of them quite considerably.

Annoyingly, the character lighting setting is global for all characters, including npcs. I’d like to turn it up a bit for myself but then I see it makes npcs in the distance glow and look odd. Would be nice to separate those out into self and others.

I always had the character lighting turned right up on the older graphics and never thought it particularly made characters glow. I assume it increased the entire brightness fairly evenly. (It's also probably why I don't recall having lighting issues with my dark-skinned alt character much, despite other people talking about that being an issue.)

I switched from PS4 to PS5 when Dawntrail released and the setting didn't carry over, but I've seen people commenting that it makes characters look worse in the new graphics, so I've been wary of turning it back on.

[eohippus]

I haven't been following this thread as closely as I followed other graphics update threads post benchmark 1 and 2, but there's been three major issues sticking out to me (no pics, because I'm still assembling them all)

1. Dark skin tones are way, way too reflective. This is more pronounced on player character models than it is on Erenville. Dark skin does reflect light, but the way that it has been rendered in XIV makes it look like my character is coated in oil. This is most obvious when you pick from the farthest row to the right. I'm hopeful that this is something that can be tweaked/will be adjusted later.

2. Skin tones were lightened across the board, and all male midlander skin appears to have been made more gray/cool toned. My character lost all sense of contrast between his skin and his hair color with the update, so I had to use the free fantasia to take him to the darkest option. End result still is not the same as what he looked like pre-update. Wondering if an RGB value has been incorrectly handled that makes all the skin both cooler and lighter. (Even some tan midlander npcs now look duskwight level gray.)

3. Changes to things like mouth/lip shape and eye shape are just as noticeable in cutscenes, and they feel more pronounced on midlander 5 than I thought they would.

Last two problems could be tweaked with slight edits to the models or just adding more options to the CC. Especially regarding skin tone. There could easily be an additional 4 rows added between the second to last and last option for midlanders.

[eohippus]

also, as a few asides....lots of expressions look wonky on my midlander (including his smile! which is used to often in cutscenes. it curves up instead of going out and up like a smile does irl). his lips no longer had a clear definition against his skin so I had to give him lipstick just for a semblance of that. and makeup (which is drastically lighter!) no longer sits correctly on his face. the eyeshadow somehow falls above his eyebrows lol. these are both things I assume might get tweaked or corrected later but I thought it was worth mentioning them too.

[CidHeiral]

Being "old" doesn't automatically make it "busted" or the new version better. I'd say they busted the models in the update.

"Old and busted" is an expression. It doesn't literally mean it's bad because it's old. Whether someone prefers the old or new models is a matter of opinion. If you feel the new ones are busted then more power to you my friend.

Even if the old shadows were "faked", that ultimately means they were placed where a human artist believed the shadows should sit on the character, and it becomes an integral part of how the character is supposed to look.

Additionally, it's not just a matter of new lighting on the same faces. The face structures have been changed, some of them quite considerably.

We'll have to agree to disagree here.

[Iscah]

We'll have to agree to disagree here.

Disagree on which part?

The character models have undeniably been altered. The shapes of features have changed in ways that cannot be attributed to the change in lighting.

It's also a straightforward fact that the old shadows were deliberately placed. And whether they were "right" or not, it told you about the intended shape of the face, and in real lighting you still need to see similar contours for the character to look like they have the same face shape they did before.

Also, just because "old and busted" is a phrase that exists doesn't mean it should be applied to things that are old but not busted.

[Cheapshot]

We'll have to agree to disagree here.

No, they’re right. They factually did change. All heads now use the same universal base mesh and they used shapekeys to rebuild the features. Many faces features are not very accurate to the original and some are straight up completely different. I’ve done direct mesh comparison. Some people are more “face blind” than others and some have a more sensitive eye for details but regardless the objective truth is that the meshes did change and to varying degrees.

[CidHeiral]

Also, just because "old and busted" is a phrase that exists doesn't mean it should be applied to things that are old but not busted.

Whether the old models were busted or not is entirely subjective. I think the new models are a massive upgrade over the old ones. You clearly do not and that's okay.

No, they’re right. They factually did change. All heads now use the same universal base mesh and they used shapekeys to rebuild the features. Many faces features are not very accurate to the original and some are straight up completely different. I’ve done direct mesh comparison. Some people are more “face blind” than others and some have a more sensitive eye for details but regardless the objective truth is that the meshes did change and to varying degrees.

I don't deny there are some subtle differences but I have yet to see the radical, unrecognizable differences that are being claimed. But like I've said before, everyone is entitled to have their own opinion on their character. I was discussing the lighting in general, not everyone's individual character grievances.

[Cheapshot]

Whether the old models were busted or not is entirely subjective. I think the new models are a massive upgrade over the old ones. You clearly do not and that's okay.



I don't deny there are some subtle differences but I have yet to see the radical, unrecognizable differences that are being claimed. But like I've said before, everyone is entitled to have their own opinion on their character. I was discussing the lighting in general, not everyone's individual character grievances.

Oh so you’re just wasting peoples time with semantics and strawmen. Sorry, I mistook you for someone discussing things in good faith for some reason, my bad. You think the new models are a “massive upgrade” but also you’re telling people the changes are so subtle they shouldn’t care so much? Hey which is it? I should just stick to leaving my feedback and not bother offering my knowledge in the discussion to people who are just going to turn out to be here to be contrarian and have no interest in common ground.