"Positionals Are Bad Because Other Players Can Impact Them"

[Aco505]

Moving slightly left or right around the bosses hitbox for a marginal damage increase is not something I would consider exciting, not to mention you can ignore all that a lot of the time by using true north, which could be removed if positionals weren't a thing, alleviating the oh so terrible button bloat.

Every time this kind of argument is used, I know for a fact that the person saying it likely does not main melee DPS jobs.

Sure, you have to move one inch to the left or right in a fully static dummy boss. But that's not what makes positionals interesting.

And even in those cases, at least they keep you moving. Otherwise, you'd just stand still in one spot until mechanics forced you to change.

Positionals must stay because their removal would not be replaced with something interesting. Just don't hit them if you dislike them, they're marginal as you put it. Tanks are accessible melee jobs that have no positionals.

We don't argue for cast times and Swiftcast to be removed so I don't see why positionals should be.

[Payadopa]

It's an MMO. Of course others should influence you. That's kind of the point. Otherwise it's just a single player RPG with extra steps. This community. Smh

[Sylvain]

Remove positionals, problem solved. It's an outdated system that should have been removed years ago and, hopefully, be replaced with something more interesting.

Errggg I like positional...
We can argue on wether forced (old dragoon) vs on demand (reaper) positionals is better, but I enjoy positional.
Maybe some jobs had a bit too many, it's true dragoon had 3 positional in a row with the DoT combo, that might have been a bit too much.

But positional are an essential part of making melee feel engaging, like casting for casters. To me at least. Without positional, melee just feel like a range with limited range.

[Trigonx]

If you can't feel engaged with a melee class because you cant move a pixel left or right thats a problem of encounter design. I have played dragoon up until shadowbringers and never enjoyed the dance done during raiding. I had more fun engaging with a boss when I didnt need to check if I was in the right spot for a positional and more when i had to check if I was in the right position to resolve a mechanic.

When I switched to tank I was already keeping the boss in one direction and position as much as possible for the dps because of my experience but as a tank that gets mindnumbing cause we literally have nothing to do for most encounters besides a tank swap if that, busters, or the occasional pair stack.

Removing positionals will allow for more mechanical load to be placed on players, the only balancing act here would be to make it manageable for casters.

Removing positionals would also really add to more dynamic boss fights that allow for tanks to play a more active role in encounters. There is a reason why the tank buster in the new ex is liked by a lot of people and its because the tank is more actively engaged in that buster to protect the party then previous encounters. (Barring necessary tank lb but that isn't as engaging.)

Removing positionals can create party mechanics that require such movements that if you are experienced and or skilled enough you can maintain full uptime as a melee during dangerous mechanics and make noticeable dps contributions that are distinct from safe play. You can argue this already happens but those usually tend to be for bosses that have no positionals requirements. I have also noticed in this expac more forced downtime making this a less likely thing to do unless you play with a group of friends that can protect you with the active vuln stack and is prepared for it.

Hell removing positionals can force people in front of a boss when a tank buster is going out so that they really have to place themselves accordingly and play accurately.

Removing positionals should create more dynamic encounter design which is for more engaging to a player than again moving a minute pixel left or right for a potency gain thats negligible to a majority of the player base for the content they do.

Will even go further with yeah fix the class homogenization by creating varying utilities based off of distinct combos thats unique to the class executing them. I am talking like every time you execute a 213 combo you stack a damage debuff to a boss or a 312 combo that lets the party heal off of every auto attack as just examples of things to do .The sustain of these utilities in a dynamic encounter is a better representation of skill expression than positionals.

All in all not letting positionals go away limits what can be done in encounter design which overall will create less engaging experiences

[Mikey_R]

If you can't feel engaged with a melee class because you cant move a pixel left or right thats a problem of encounter design. I have played dragoon up until shadowbringers and never enjoyed the dance done during raiding. I had more fun engaging with a boss when I didnt need to check if I was in the right spot for a positional and more when i had to check if I was in the right position to resolve a mechanic.

...

None of what you have said is anything against positionals. Infact I would argue it would be more in favour as you then have to plan out your True North uses to accommodate the boss mechanics, just as casters plan their insta-cast spells/Swiftcast uses to accommodate boss mechanics.

I should probably add, my main DPS is Monk. Back in the day, when it had a positional on almost every attack, it was fun manoeuvring yourself around mechanics to keep uptime and positional requirements, which also includes planning WHERE to dodge. Don't just run back, run back at an angle so that I can dash back in and be at he correct position. etc.

[Aco505]

Snip

Positionals have never dictated fight design, and there's plenty of omnidirectional fights that are not really enjoyable (e. g. P7 and imho P12-2S).

[Derio]

Outdated system. When you have omnidirectional bosses, that aspect of the game goes out of the window to where the positional doesnt matter and true north doesnt matter.

If they got rid of positionals they could allow for more complex rotations and more job identity.

I dont mind positionals but IMO they also dont add any value to gameplay and the only reason for doing them is for a bit more potency which is much more forgiving from its first inception to where it could break your combo if you didnt hit the positional.

[Ramiee]

Outdated system. When you have omnidirectional bosses, that aspect of the game goes out of the window to where the positional doesnt matter and true north doesnt matter.

If they got rid of positionals they could allow for more complex rotations and more job identity.

I dont mind positionals but IMO they also dont add any value to gameplay and the only reason for doing them is for a bit more potency which is much more forgiving from its first inception to where it could break your combo if you didnt hit the positional.

I think it can be a part of some melees. PIC and BLM both have casting and the other mages don't have as much casting as them. Do the same with positionals. Maybe make scouting or striking the only ones with them.

[Mikey_R]

If they got rid of positionals they could allow for more complex rotations and more job identity.

Positionals don't stop more complex rotations from happening and can form part of a job's identity (RIP 100% positional Monk).

[Tunda]

Positionals don't stop more complex rotations from happening and can form part of a job's identity (RIP 100% positional Monk).

Monk is horrible job until endwalker

good they change how clunky it was