Dawntrail - What abilities do you think need to be trimmed from the game?

[Grizzlpaw]

We need a mass un-trim

[Fawkes]

We need a mass un-trim

I'd like Protect, Stoneskin II, and Aero 3 back.

[Shougun]

On the topic of positional, I think it's a mechanic that adds difference and opportunity for varied play... I can respect that not everyone likes them (and not every job needs them), but if we removed them entirely.. without some other thought, we are continuingly complicit in the homogenization that we also complain about..

I'd like Protect, Stoneskin II, and Aero 3 back.

For Protect and Stoneskin it might be nice to see them do something that gives them benefit to not be just a pre-party spell.

Perhaps like protect reduces damage, as we know, but for 10 seconds it will further reduce damage (so now you have a reason to recast it in fights- of course it gets a cooldown then). Like original stoneskin II, I don't think that'd be that great to fill up bar space /as it was/ but taking that protect approach again you might have something like AoE party shield (lasting a long time as before), chance on damage spell to trigger a free effect which causes you to regenerate the stoneskin of allies by some % and lightly damage nearby enemies (to make this less annoying there would be two buffs, one stone chalice that allows you to enfuse players with stone protection and then the stoneskin itself which naturally vanishes as the shield is used). Could use that mechanic for enstone spells (carry on that suggestion I had in another thread about splitting healers with offensive and support).

Another thought is, actually 'do' bring back out of combat spells, but they can be in their own little handy bar (like special actions for certain raids and island sanctuary). At that point can add a lot of goofy roleplay spells too, like how in WoW you could mind control someone as a priest lol. Since WHM has access to water, could be like water walking / skirt (gracefully dash across water surfaces out of combat), which was a random example and not something that I think must be done (that you could have an additional 'character' building bar that doesn't add clunk while directly in combat).

My main concern, and certainly one option is just for myself to play more compact jobs and ignore fat ones lol, is that if you add a bunch of spells like "cast once and ignore", which can add character, it just mainly serves to fill up the bar and take up space (imo). So I'd like to hope to encourage clever stacking of abilities where possible. 1 -> 2 -> 3, for example, is not, imo, really needed and could be collapsed and then if there is space add back perhaps an ability that does something entirely new and interesting.

[BeserkFury]

On the topic of positional, I think it's a mechanic that adds difference and opportunity for varied play... I can respect that not everyone likes them (and not every job needs them), but if we removed them entirely.. without some other thought, we are continuingly complicit in the homogenization that we also complain about..

My issue with positions is they feel really tedious to use when attached to GCD abilities, the only positional I really liked was trick attack for that reason being a thing you cared about every 60s. So if more positionals were locked behind high cooldown abilities thats a reasonable design space to explore

[Rithy255]

this and remove damage mit from dps

Why?
Is it really that hard for DPS to press the faint/addle button to help the group? I don't know what's the Issue with DPS being able to contribute a small amount of mitigation (in a non DPS way) in a team based game.

My issue with positions is they feel really tedious to use when attached to GCD abilities, the only positional I really liked was trick attack for that reason being a thing you cared about every 60s. So if more positionals were locked behind high cooldown abilities thats a reasonable design space to explore

I don't know how positional are tedious to use, they're a way of optimising damage output, skill expression in fights that are varied, I think the issue is more that True North is so frequent and that hitboxes are pretty massive, I think having them behind large cooldowns kind of defeats the purpose of having them.

I think positional add a lot to the melee gameplay when done right, I don't think I'd enjoy melee without consistent positional, I'd prefer if they actually became more meaningful if anything.