What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[Xirean]

Where is your evidence that they would not summon Zodiark if warned?

Also didn't you kind of admit a false premise here. What evidence do we have she wasn't preparing? She mentions preparing as soon as we tell her. Stopping Hermes is preparing. She fails. She mentions preparing after we leave. She fails. So you're assuming Venat's behavior here based on what?

Which, it's fine that is your opinion. I'm just asking the same questions you ask.

First off I don't need to source if they will or won't summon Zodiark after being informed. I don't think they would but that's not the point. The point is them getting the chance to try something else by having both more time and information. If that is shown to be the case and it still ends in failure, ok. That's fine. They had the chance to try which is all I want.

If for whatever reason you think there are no other things they could try then I would direct you to the existence of Meteion. She is an Ancient creation that can interact with and manipulate dynamis. Because she exists at all that means there is the potential for something else like her to be created with a different function. Which of course might fail and that's ok. At least they had the chance to try. This is what is meant by Venat having the only agency in the situation. Because she is the only one afforded a choice to make.

Also I find it rather hilarious that you suddenly ask for a source when your go to source has effectively been "Yoshi P said I could make it up."

Also also you didn't dismantle anything about the use of the word genocide in this conversation. Your opinion is that I'm using it for shock value. Clearly you won't accept that I'm not doing that, but that's not a dismantle.

[Turtledeluxe]

They had the chance to try which is all I want.

If for whatever reason you think there are no other things they could try

Also I find it rather hilarious that you suddenly ask for a source when your go to source has effectively been "Yoshi P said I could make it up."

Also also you didn't dismantle anything about the use of the word genocide in this conversation. Your opinion is that I'm using it for shock value. Clearly you won't accept that I'm not doing that, but that's not a dismantle.

So it's a false premise. We don't have any evidence they weren't given a chance to try, in fact we were given the opposite. Venat is warning them in the abstraction you are shown. Just because she doesn't say "Meteion did it" doesn't mean she did nothing. So I guess your issue here is that she didn't warn them enough? I dont know what this is based on. I assume the abstraction was meant to give us an idea of what happened over days or weeks. Your opinion is that Venat waited until the very final second of a sacrifice to Zodiark to appeal to the summoners? That was for dramatic effect. I don't think that sounds plausible or consistent with any of her behavior prior to that. I think all of you are taking advantage of the way everything is shown to paint a certain picture. "Welp this five minutes is the whole final days so there it is, no choice". We know it was more than five minutes because more sacrifices were being planned after the summoning and that is part of what pushed Venat in the direction of the sundering. There was some kind of dialogue happening but we don't know the timetable exactly.

While we don't have confirmation on all the rules of time travel in XIV, for *this instance* we are clearly told we can't change the fate to come. And the reason Elidibus says what he says is to prevent the past tampering to break the future. What you are talking about works on a conceptual level for general arguments but it doesn't work for XIV and the story being told here bc they set a rule in place that wouldn't break the game.

Whats hilarious is that you don't know how definitions work, can't find a better word to describe what happened, and are seemingly triggered because you operate just as much as on theory as everyone else.