Revelations from Patch 6.4: The Dark Throne

[Yuella]

They gated Shadowbringers relic behind Stormblood 24-man raid. It's not a big ask to force players to do Eden. It's just 12 quick trials.

[Heroman3003]

Again: you think that because you already did all of those things voluntarily, so to you this is not a big ask. This would be poison to the greater community and long-term growth of the game, because a whole lot of people don't do those things for actual reasons, they don't want to be forced to.

Think about what your response would be to the game gating the next expansion behind Feast of Famine. Think about that as the barrier, rather than content you already did so you don't think it's a barrier.

...Actually probably a bad example, I can tell Heroman's already done that quest, but looking at his achievements there's very little he hasn't done except for a weird smattering of jobs I can't find pattern to. But my point is 'you think this isn't a barrier because it wasn't to you personally, so substitute it with something you actually don't want to do'.

The only really 'too difficult' or 'too long' content currently in the category I mention is Bahamut Raids with their difficulty. IMO, they should be reworked to be on par with existing raids in their level-synced difficulty either way, regardless of whether they're made mandatory or not.

Also pattern to jobs I have and haven't done is "I've done one in every role for ShB/EW role quest purposes, and rest are being done slowly over time in order of which aesthetics I like more", if you're actually curious.

Either way, the fact that stuff like Gaia, Gaius, all the Ivalice stuff, all the Mhach stuff are locked in the 'side content jail' is plain terrible. Because I am certain there will be time when instead of taking those characters out of that jail, they will just make blander copies 'fit for MSQ' and that will suck both for the side content and MSQ. Although with the fact that they weren't at all afraid to do things like locking Bozja behind Ivalice or locking EW relics behind *MANDERVILLE* of all things is a sign that they have no qualms about making things require you go through past content.

[Iscah]

They gated Shadowbringers relic behind Stormblood 24-man raid. It's not a big ask to force players to do Eden. It's just 12 quick trials.

That was gating side content behind other side content though.

I would like for them to make more of the easy side content mandatory for MSQ plot's sake, but that isn't proof of them doing it.

[Cleretic]

Them making Hildibrand mandatory for the EW relics was also unpopular, remember, and Hildibrand is the easiest side-content in the entire game. (well, unless you have a crippling allergy to extremely Japanese slapstick and jokes that don't work outside their original cultural contexts; if you do Hildibrand can be kinda tough.)

Basically the only times I've seen locking future side-content behind past side-content be received positively are were when the future side content is basically just cutscenes (void quests, Tataru), because that turns it into just a continuation of the plot, which is absolutely what they're gonna do with Gaia eventually, possibly very soon. Bozja behind Ivalice got early grumbles, mostly from people who suddenly had to get those raid queues to pop, but ironically Bozja itself seemed to solve that problem by incentivizing the Ivalice raids later on; not exactly a solution that's available fairly often, sadly.

[Heroman3003]

Them making Hildibrand mandatory for the EW relics was also unpopular, remember, and Hildibrand is the easiest side-content in the entire game. (well, unless you have a crippling allergy to extremely Japanese slapstick and jokes that don't work outside their original cultural contexts; if you do Hildibrand can be kinda tough.)

Basically the only times I've seen locking future side-content behind past side-content be received positively are were when the future side content is basically just cutscenes (void quests, Tataru), because that turns it into just a continuation of the plot, which is absolutely what they're gonna do with Gaia eventually, possibly very soon. Bozja behind Ivalice got early grumbles, mostly from people who suddenly had to get those raid queues to pop, but ironically Bozja itself seemed to solve that problem by incentivizing the Ivalice raids later on; not exactly a solution that's available fairly often, sadly.

One piece of content I don't see much potential for anything to be locked behind (to my extreme dismay) is Role Quests. Both 'capstone' role quests for ShB with void stuff and EW with Garlemald stuff have such great potential for future stories, but are locked behind one thing I don't think SE will have the courage to lock anything behind - having at least 4 (or 5 for EW) different jobs levelled all the way to 80 (90 for EW). That IS a barrier of entry too big and that's why it's saddening to see some of best plot hooks for future be put in the Role Quest finales.

[Yuella]

If they add a caster and ranged in 7.0 and then tank and healer in 8.0, they will start at level 80 and 90 and players can unlock them and immediately do the ShB role quests

[Cleretic]

If they add a caster and ranged in 7.0 and then tank and healer in 8.0, they will start at level 80 and 90 and players can unlock them and immediately do the ShB role quests

I dread the leveling roulette come 7.0, when we're going to get people (quite possibly even tanks) doing Holminster Switch on jobs and roles they've never touched before in their life.

[SannaR]

I dread the leveling roulette come 7.0, when we're going to get people (quite possibly even tanks) doing Holminster Switch on jobs and roles they've never touched before in their life.

Didn't we have that already with fresh gunbreakers? Course I still run into the "I just got to HW and I now I can finally play as DRK and stop playing as this other role." in other sections of the game. It's those kinds of players that make me go why didn't you play something else in the role so you could at least know how something in that sort of slot plays? Course that only really works for Healers and Tanks as even dps that are in the same sub category play differently.

[Cleretic]

Didn't we have that already with fresh gunbreakers? Course I still run into the "I just got to HW and I now I can finally play as DRK and stop playing as this other role." in other sections of the game. It's those kinds of players that make me go why didn't you play something else in the role so you could at least know how something in that sort of slot plays? Course that only really works for Healers and Tanks as even dps that are in the same sub category play differently.

Oh, hey, you're right. I guess I just didn't really notice becuase I mostly play healers, so I dodged the Sages that don't understand their kit. The Tower of Zot's still a bit of a rude one, though; not as bad as Holminster, but still not very nice.

I do still think that jacking up starting job levels beyond 50 was a mistake for this reason; after a point I want to assume that someone knows how to play their job, and I don't know exactly where that point is, but I feel like jobs are definitely starting past it at this stage.

[Darko]

Just finished 6.4 and I have some feedback about the end of the patch's MSQ.

Azdaja was corrupted by Void energy, I imagine that gave her a power boost, but she still had her aether depleted for thousands of years and hasn't fought for that duration either. Vrtra didn't suffer from either of those disadvantages yet she still took him down so quickly. That fight should have been closer. That's minor though.

After the fight against Golbez-D he says "you won the battle". It didn't feel like that at all. We're on the Thirteenth, he can't die, I get that. But he doesn't even flinch from any wounds, not even for a moment. Just floats up and does his bad guy stuff as if nothing happened, while we all stand/lie there. The Warrior of Light, a veteran of countless battles, just watches. Same for Zero who has the ability to seal voidsent. Perhaps it wouldn't have worked, but she doesn't even try to attack. Azdaja floats there while Golbez gloats, but even if he's too wounded to fight, Vrtra doesn't even try either. Only after Azdaja gets turned into a voidsent does one person attack, Zero, while the rest of us are still watching and in the WoL's case, gnashing our teeth.

The story itself is fine, but the way it's executed at the end leaves much to be desired. I don't mind that we couldn't save Azdaja (yet) and that she transformed into a voidsent, but we should have at least attempted to stop it.