End Game hopes & wants

[Jinko]

I like the idea of random generated dungeons, Moblin Maze Monger in 11 (although not end game) was a pretty good idea and I hope they bring it over to FF14 eventually.

no...we don't need WoW-ish endgame. Raids are far from fun, I've been there...and hated it

Well 11 had instanced raids in the form of Nyzel and Assult, I think its the only way to go for true end game content.

[Dubont]

"Catering to this sort of attitude is a problem. I'm sorry to use you as an example Dubont. But it comes across as unfriendly. Generally if people want to pick an odd pairing they will try and make it work within the system, or they just dont have time to level another class to half of their main and being excluded from everything will make them quit."

Maybe, but humans like efficiency and if someone tried something and it worked, then fine, let them use it, but if it just doesn't work...I shouldn't be forced to let them use it in MY party. Let's look at Sam. If you want to go...Sam/war, awesome. Sam/thf? Awesome. Same/drg? With the right gear, very awesome!! Sam/whm? Sorry...wut? Sam/blm? What are you going to do...stone 1 them to death?

"and uhh.. I dont ...quite..follow. The Disgaea series has a pretty robust selection of things to do outside of what could be considered the main game and those are typically encapsulated by the term endgame.."
I see what you're saying. FFXI also had endgame NMs that weren't technically "endgame," but they were referred to as endgame because most people didn't do them until they had finished the story...the actually endgame. I guess the NMs should be somewhat of an aftergame event.

[Jinko]

I duno why you guys are even bringing up subjobs, it doesn't apply and unless SE soes something stupid to the armory system its not going to.

Of course people could still frown on others for using the wrong skill set ups in FF14, having the wrong stats in the wrong places, and I would probably have to agree with Dubont on this as nobody wants a gimp player in their party holding them back.

[Nephera]

Maybe, but humans like efficiency and if someone tried something and it worked, then fine, let them use it, but if it just doesn't work...I shouldn't be forced to let them use it in MY party. Let's look at Sam. If you want to go...Sam/war, awesome. Sam/thf? Awesome. Same/drg? With the right gear, very awesome!! Sam/whm? Sorry...wut? Sam/blm? What are you going to do...stone 1 them to death?

Well ultimately nobody can force you to play with someone you dont want to play with, I mean they cant actually invade your party, but the problem is the more the system supports one particular build it also stifles the freedom of that awesome sam/thf and that sam/drg that worked so hard to get the gear he needed.

Like you know what i'm saying? The system should encourage people to give other people chances. Cooperation and compromise and the like. Take champions online for instance: I never ever know what i'm getting when i invite a new player to a party other than the role they tell me they play (Tank,damage dealer, healer, crowd control) and my decision to play with them further is influenced predominantly by the way that they play and how well they play, not how they built their character. If they flat out suck, welp I just dont invite them again. (Well i'm pretty lenient, they'd have to suck and also be a jerk.)

I see what you're saying. FFXI also had endgame NMs that weren't technically "endgame," but they were referred to as endgame because most people didn't do them until they had finished the story...the actually endgame. I guess the NMs should be somewhat of an aftergame event.

Ah ok.

[Abriael]

This idea sounds nice on paper (as long as it's something on the side, and not the MAIN endgame), but it has a serious implementation problem.

Endgame bosses in all games are fun encounters because they have been carefully balanced and tested. Introducing dynamically generated ones (unless they are just picked up from a list of pre-made bosses, and then they aren't really dynamic anymore), implies that they would have to be extremely generic, because of course it would be impossible to balance and test perfectly every cimbination of variables, if they were anywhere complex.

This means that most encounters would be a simple tank and spank against a mob that just hits hard and has lots of HP, and spams some sort of powerful special attack with generic results.

Honestly I'm not so sure, unless Se manages to pull out something I can't really imagine, that this warrants the required resources.
I'd rather have a less generic and more polished endgame, and then, when that's well rooted and in place, they can tink about different solutions.

[Xatsh]

Having raid events I am ok with, having pointless raids (no story) is really fail, and having all raids as the only endgame event is also fail.

As for random generated dungeons as others said something MMM could work I guess was sorta random, Einherjar the mobs where random.

As much as people complained about ffxi being OMG too hardcore in endgame after the release of ToaU I think FFXI had probally the most ballanced endgame of anygame out there. a ton of 30min instances, 100min instances, World Random Spawns, Forced Spawns, 3hr raids, 2hr raids, 45mins raids... basically something for everyone more or less. And endgame like this honestly would be perfect gives the hardcore ppl something do but has the majority focused around the 30min-1hr point for the casuals.

As for class requirements there will still be requirements, especially if SE removes the armory system like the majority are demanding. You will have your best DD setups, Best Tank setups, Best Support Setups, and Best Healing Setups. And it will become law after awhile in endgame just like every other mmo. Eventually everything will be cookie cuttered.

[bird]

I really enjoyed instanced low-men events from ffxi like limbus, and znm for popped nms. If ffxiv can design something similar with exclusive gear and gear upgrade items, I would love it!

Eta: bcnms were great too, but I guess that's similar to faction nms. Tho the item drop rates could use a little tweaking. :P

[Grimm]

. now when you say no story do you mean none at all? Or with their own unique ones that are independant of anything we already have. None at all probably wouldnt work, it'd feel rather lazy.

With it's own mini story that can tie into the main story something like an evil engineer from the empire has constructed a moving labyrinth that you must find your way through. It can also have interesting things like trap doors that make you fall back to a previous level/area, Poison rooms where you must defeat mobs under the poison effect to open the next door., MP drain rooms, ect.. that way it's different every time and it\s not the same route each time.

Edit: They can also make it so the mobs = tough for the parties strength once you enter. That way it can be considered low level content as well. But of course the real fun is not till you are at Rank Cap.

[Griss]

Something that i can get together with my friends and shell mates to do on a weekly or daily basis for fun and profit. that's my hope for end game. Don't particularly care what form it comes in. Right now the free spawn Nm's are some what scratching that itch but more variety is always welcome.

[Lock_Hyur]

As for class requirements there will still be requirements, especially if SE removes the armory system like the majority are demanding. You will have your best DD setups, Best Tank setups, Best Support Setups, and Best Healing Setups. And it will become law after awhile in endgame just like every other mmo. Eventually everything will be cookie cuttered.

BINGO This^

Im glad someone else has a brain. Im tired of these posts I see with people thinking there will be endless possibilities to be a unique butterfly. No.. no unique butterfly. There will be 'best' setups of certain abilities and certain gear to maximize/minimize effects within a certain class.