Anyone else think caster has suffered this expansion? (hopes for the future)

[Lyth]

On the first bit, I believe BLM should get a raise. Call it Defibrilate. Make it an oGCD, cost 0 mana (not like BLM cares,) and give it something like a 5m cooldown. You get 1, maybe 2 in an entire fight. For RDM, give it a much more expensive mana cost. Something like 5000 mana. For SMN, make it a 120+ second cooldown. That said I also like the concept of limiting resing. My favorite fights all come from Baldesion Arsenal and Delubrum Reginae Savage, a lot of the times because the mechanics are easy, but messing up a mechanic might eventually kill you, and deaths sting hard.

BLM is the easiest to use but you can only use it once. SMN is middling but still limited. RDM can be used repeatedly but is mana expensive (fix RDM's mana economy as well since they can't chain res.) Or, obviously, get rid of res.

I think you're less likely to see non-healer raises removed, because they help players clear casual content that could otherwise cause story bottlenecks. You've seen trial roulette fights that the general playerbase struggles with. The extra raises just soften that check a bit.

I think the reason why they're reluctant to add raise on BLM is a series lore/historical reason, more than anything else. You'd expect to see a PLD battle raise before a BLM one, and the latter would create some controversy, ARR cross-class aside. I can understand why this is frustrating, because the lack of Raise has historically been waved around as an excuse to give BLM a dps advantage over other casters. I think the simple answer is more jobs that bring raise, and more restrictions around its use (i.e. add a long recast, limit uses per pull, share recast or uses/pull across all players bringing a battle raise). If it's more prevalent and there's a shared usage restriction, it doesn't matter if any one job doesn't happen to bring it.

[Shiroe]

this expansion, at least on harder content, "rez" is not that helpful.., this expansion, if someone dies, it's often a wipe.., seldomly does an extra caster rez influence much on harder content
... and since Criterion has limited rezes, there is no open world like Eureka / Boja, where rezes/ Rdm were verz useful..

... this expansion, th caster rezes are minor (besides they really eat MP), Rez-Casters are in general less needed this tim, ...but them also having LOW DPS is almost too much.. (theyre useless, at least others bring real utility or real dps..)

thanx to the role party buffs, casters get in PFs for harder content..

Casters are really bad off

... but Casters have had spotlights in some expansions (Blm scheining for almost 2.., Smn atleast 1 expansion and never "bad/unwatend") Rdm the same..), now Melee can have it.., also since Rpr is new, let his role shein this expansion

... but do hope Casters can sheim again, or be equal with the all the best, sometime soon

[Taranok]

I think you're less likely to see non-healer raises removed, because they help players clear casual content that could otherwise cause story bottlenecks. You've seen trial roulette fights that the general playerbase struggles with. The extra raises just soften that check a bit.

I think the reason why they're reluctant to add raise on BLM is a series lore/historical reason, more than anything else. You'd expect to see a PLD battle raise before a BLM one, and the latter would create some controversy, ARR cross-class aside. I can understand why this is frustrating, because the lack of Raise has historically been waved around as an excuse to give BLM a dps advantage over other casters. I think the simple answer is more jobs that bring raise, and more restrictions around its use (i.e. add a long recast, limit uses per pull, share recast or uses/pull across all players bringing a battle raise). If it's more prevalent and there's a shared usage restriction, it doesn't matter if any one job doesn't happen to bring it.

Considering they've bent over and broken the lore repeatedly, tradition truly is a bad precedent to deny BLM a res. BLM existing as a mushroom in the game is a problem for BLM and the balance of all jobs, but esp. caster DPS. They could also take BLM, MCH, and SAM, and put them into their own 4th category of DPS as "selfish DPS," officially codify it into the game's party system and then it being a special snowflake can be balanced across all greedy DPS.

Likewise, if res utility is the only thing making it so parties don't get bottlenecked in story content, that says more about how the fights are designed than whether resses should be kept. Literally the argument is that the fights are too hard and need multiple resses to keep people moving through the story.

Neither of those are particularly valid excuses to keep a class in a role defined around X thing as not having it. Either take BLM out of the role or fix the problem of non-matched and very important utility.

Also res utility is a very, very bad reason to balance down the DPS of any class. If the devs have that big a problem with ressing, then just limit resses to begin with. It makes for a better fight anyways.

[Lyth]

If you implement the restrictions we discussed earlier, an individual job not having access to raise becomes a non-issue. I don't think there's anything wrong with BLM having access to a raise, personally, but if it's going to become a 'caster role action' there will need to be some fairly strict limitations placed around its use (i.e. shared recast across your team). Creating more fake role subgroups seems like a bad idea, when they ideally should be condensing these down into melee and ranged. I know the idea of creating a special mandatory role slot for BLM sounds enticing, but if you're a good player, you'll have your spot reserved for you.

[CelestiCer]

So, idk how much BLM you play but everything about what you have said about it, especially in comparison to RDM is just demonstrably wrong. starting with Magick Barrier and Manaward...

Regarding End-Game content, we have the same BLM/RDM playtime. Difference that I'm not stuck in a bubble seeing a Static I'm not part of. My PoV is that of PF, where I see RDM die the most even at full HP. Saw this thread, and thought I share my 2 cents.

• Vercure is not a Mitigation skill its a Heal
• Manaward is thus what I compare to
• Magick Barrier another Mitigation skill

Magick Barrier doesn't cover Physical Damage even if its a Raidwide shield, creating disparity in available Self-Mitigation. Falsely accusing me of ignoring the fact its a raidbuff is rich as I pointed it out in both pictures and text.

for movement, yes RDMs movement is restrictive,...

Case in point.
You admitted it yourself RDM movement is restrictive and we both agree. I care not for how wrongfully you can play a Job, it's about what the Jobs have available to them.

why take a BLM when the other casters offer more utility

" Why take DPS with Utility tax into fights that have been mapped/puzzled out? ".
Debunked argument point... as weeks go by, fights become less blind and more scripted with available guides. Not to mention the ilvl players are geared with to tackle the fights vs what they have at week 1.

RDM utility is a powerhouse for Prog and hard-carrying through rezzes that no other DPS can offer. I am not arguing this. My point was towards the thread topic. Which caster suffers the most in EW? I believe that to be RDM suffering from lack of Self-Mitigations and Utility Tax. BLM is perfectly fine this Expansion and considering it's performances it's also quite rich to be asking for BLM Buffs at the end of a raid tier no less... SMN lacks nuances, it's gameplay is braindead. Though that's been noted endless amounts of times since its rework.

My personal experience might be shrugged off due to it being a small sample size. Or that PF parties I joined comprised of random players use suboptimal strats and mismanage juggling mitigations, sure you're in the right of it. I'm just sharing my PoV behind the meme phrase... That it " Feels RDM " whenever a Raidwide kills them at full HP, mhm.

[Ivtrix]

Why are we comparing personal mit to party mit wtf

[Turtledeluxe]

Looks like BLM got some buffs. Interesting. I was told the world would end if this happened.

[Petite]

Every time I hear something about SMN, it's about how bland and shallow it is to play (I agree). Yet at the same time, it has the most parse counts in fflogs which means it's very popular, even with raiders.

I know people usually use the forums to vent, which skews our perception on stuff, but the disconnect between what's said said about it and its popularity is huge.

[Turtledeluxe]

Every time I hear something about SMN, it's about how bland and shallow it is to play (I agree). Yet at the same time, it has the most parse counts in fflogs which means it's very popular, even with raiders.

I know people usually use the forums to vent, which skews our perception on stuff, but the disconnect between what's said said about it and its popularity is huge.

Say it isn't so. People ITT have been muddying the conversation to distract from this? no way! I was still in fight design school (with a minor in job balance) trying to earn enough credibility to talk about buffs.

[Ivtrix]

Every time I hear something about SMN, it's about how bland and shallow it is to play (I agree). Yet at the same time, it has the most parse counts in fflogs which means it's very popular, even with raiders.

I know people usually use the forums to vent, which skews our perception on stuff, but the disconnect between what's said said about it and its popularity is huge.

It’s the most mobile caster by far.

It does comparable damage to rdm

It has its own self mitigation

It’s easy as sin to play. The only thinking with summoner is “oh boy where am I going to use ifrit?”

There’s a reason it’s wildly meta for TOP. Doesn’t mean people always enjoy it.

All ranged classes outside blm really needed a boost. But yet again let down by the devs