The atrocity that was the "In from the Cold" quest ending - *STORY RANT*

[TheMightyMollusk]

It's unrealistic if Zenos' goal was for us to hate him. I think the end of the story was also intertwined in the reason why things couldn't happen. Players can forgive the deaths of countless people we have never seen and thus get hyped about the final duel in UT, but they couldn't have forgiven the death of a main character.

I felt it fit Zenos's character. He doesn't care enough about the Scions to go out of his way to kill them. The whole thing was just provocation because he wants the WoL pissed off and coming for his head instead of playing around with worthless stuff like protecting civilians or saving the world.

[Eisi]

I felt it fit Zenos's character. He doesn't care enough about the Scions to go out of his way to kill them. The whole thing was just provocation because he wants the WoL pissed off and coming for his head instead of playing around with worthless stuff like protecting civilians or saving the world.

No he wanted us to want to kill him. He wanted us to hate him. He told us. He meant it. And yes, he should have been willing to sacrifice someone for that who didn't mean anything to him. A human life meant nothing to him, he killed so many people have you just forgotten?

[TheMightyMollusk]

No he wanted us to want to kill him. He wanted us to hate him. He told us. He meant it. And yes, he should have been willing to sacrifice someone for that who didn't mean anything to him. A human life meant nothing to him, he killed so many people have you just forgotten?

I haven't forgotten anything. The whole point, though, was that all of those other people he killed? He thought it wasn't personal enough. The WoL came to Garlemald, but we were still just screwing around, so he went to make it more personal. Killing wasn't even necessary anymore once the point was made, and for all of his callousness about life, Zenos kills for reasons, not "just because".

If anything, killing the Scions might've been counterproductive. Stopping for a burial or getting them medical attention (or, for that matter, getting put on trial or chased out by the Ilsabard Contingent, who had no idea what was going on) would've delayed the fight Zenos wanted so badly. He's showing you he could do terrible things to make you hurry up and go after him to stop him from trying again.

(Before someone starts with "Well my WoL wouldn't do any of that", yours is not the canon WoL. Despite not getting voice acting, the WoL does have a definite canon personality.)

[Eisi]

I haven't forgotten anything. The whole point, though, was that all of those other people he killed? He thought it wasn't personal enough. The WoL came to Garlemald, but we were still just screwing around, so he went to make it more personal. Killing wasn't even necessary anymore once the point was made, and for all of his callousness about life, Zenos kills for reasons, not "just because".

Wait so you think the reason why he didn't kill our friends is because the matter was too personal? No, it's the opposite, exactly because it's personal would he do whatever he can to make us hate him, how much is the man going through to get his fight, obviously he would want us to see that he's being serious, not just playing around. And that would reinforce his being serious about going for Zodiark! Like why would we stop for a funeral when the world is at stake?

Also didn't Fandaniel literally need more time to set up the tower?

[TheMightyMollusk]

Wait so you think the reason why he didn't kill our friends is because the matter was too personal?

No. I said that all of the other people he killed weren't personal enough. Stealing the WoL's body to threaten our allies was making it more personal. Killing the Scions wasn't necessary to get the point across, and Zenos has a proven history of not bothering to kill people he doesn't think are worth his time. Remember back in Stormblood, when he lost interest in Y'shtola, Lyse, Yugiri, and (the first time around) the WoL when they proved no threat to him.

No, it's the opposite, exactly because it's personal would he do whatever he can to make us hate him, how much is the man going through to get his fight, obviously he would want us to see that he's being serious, not just playing around. And that would reinforce his being serious about going for Zodiark!

From his point of view, he's literally kick-starting the end of the world and put every civilization we've ever visited at immense risk, and it still hasn't gotten him what he wants. If those untold thousands of deaths haven't done the trick, why would four or five more? Again, the whole scenario is an effort in provocation.

Also didn't Fandaniel literally need more time to set up the tower?

No. Fandaniel had (or thought he had) enough aether in the Tower already to break through Zodiark's prison. The only reason it fails is direct intervention from Hydaelyn.

[Eisi]

No. I said that all of the other people he killed weren't personal enough. Stealing the WoL's body to threaten our allies was making it more personal. Killing the Scions wasn't necessary to get the point across, and Zenos has a proven history of not bothering to kill people he doesn't think are worth his time. Remember back in Stormblood, when he lost interest in Y'shtola, Lyse, Yugiri, and (the first time around) the WoL when they proved no threat to him.

Yeah, that was bullshit in Stormblood, such a great example of plot armor. But he gained extreme interest in keeping us alive in that scene as his little pet project.

And Zenos has a proven history of killing people just like that. And he had that from the moment he was introduced in SB. The reason why he killed nobody in Rhalgr's was already because Lyse and Y'shtola needed to survive not because it was in his character to not bother slaughtering prey.

From his point of view, he's literally kick-starting the end of the world and put every civilization we've ever visited at immense risk, and it still hasn't gotten him what he wants. If those untold thousands of deaths haven't done the trick, why would four or five more? Again, the whole scenario is an effort in provocation.

Yeah killing a friend is the ultimate provocation. You're telling me someone who is willing to put the world at risk is somehow above killing when it perfectly plays into his motives?

No. Fandaniel had (or thought he had) enough aether in the Tower already to break through Zodiark's prison. The only reason it fails is direct intervention from Hydaelyn.

In that case just have her intervene anyway! It still works!

[TheMightyMollusk]

Yeah, that was bullshit in Stormblood, such a great example of plot armor. But he gained extreme interest in keeping us alive in that scene as his little pet project.

And Zenos has a proven history of killing people just like that. And he had that from the moment he was introduced in SB. The reason why he killed nobody in Rhalgr's was already because Lyse and Y'shtola needed to survive not because it was in his character to not bother slaughtering prey.

Zenos doesn't care about killing one way or the other. He kills when it serves his purposes, not out of bloodlust. Otherwise, despite his earlier speeches about "the sport of kings", lives mean nothing to him. There's no "plot armor" involved here, that's just his character. He wouldn't bat an eye if any of the above mentioned characters had died, but if they lived, so what? He'd made his point. His initial interest in the WoL comes from seeing how we improved between the fight at Rhalgr's Reach and the ambush attempt in Doma; he's basically farming us for a better fight.

And if you want to talk plot armor, we still don't have an explanation for how Zenos learned to body-surf to survive cutting his own throat back in SB. His dialogue indicates that even he doesn't know how he did it.

Yeah killing a friend is the ultimate provocation. You're telling me someone who is willing to put the world at risk is somehow above killing when it perfectly plays into his motives?

I already answered this in the very post you quoted.

From his point of view, he's literally kick-starting the end of the world and put every civilization we've ever visited at immense risk, and it still hasn't gotten him what he wants. If those untold thousands of deaths haven't done the trick, why would four or five more?

Again: He's not above killing. He just doesn't care about it. Mass murder already failed to do what he wanted, so more would be a waste of effort.