Dps jobs share at least 90% of their abilities

[Kaliesto]

I agree with the broader intention, but not the approach.

Jobs needn't feel different just because they're comparatively useful useless against A and only because comparatively useful against B (and that often only because others are locked out of really interacting with B while the job in question, at least, isn't so stripped of gameplay in that setting).

There's plenty of room also for jobs to differentiate their capacities in less rock-paper-scissors but nonetheless highly noticeable ways.

To use the example of flying enemies, Air Anchor should be able to bring a flier down to the ground so melee can assault it, but a Dragoon certainly shouldn't need that; they're melee... who literally hunt dragons out of the sky. Similarly, just timing a Fell Cleave for when the enemy dips into range just as it hits you would do the trick just fine.

The problem is that doing more than just lock-outs to make X useless and Y thereby comparatively useful takes a lot more design depth, in a technical/mechanical sense. Doing things with enemy mass so that Monk and, especially, heavy weapons wielders like DRK and WAR have an advantage in staggering enemies and AST can help lighten them as to let upward-striking skills like Full Thrust, Inner Beast, Shadow Fang, and The Forbidden Chakra punt enemies into airtime... obviously wouldn't be easy even before accounting for the ragdoll physics required.

Still, I'd love to see what a game that looks like it has a decent physics engine for a change, instead of a mockery of one, could do in that regard -- pipedream or no.

Honestly whatever it takes for Jobs to have a bit more identity again, I can't stand how it is right now. Only The Freaking Blue Mage actually has its identity in its own unique way which is hilarious at this point.

[Shurrikhan]

Sorry, had forgotten to edit the phone-based post before and its worrying (stroke-like) number of typos. Corrected:

I agree with the broader intention, but not the approach.

Jobs needn't feel different just because they're comparatively useless against A and comparatively useful against B (and that often only because others are locked out of really interacting with B while the job in question, at least, isn't so stripped of gameplay in that setting).

There's plenty of room also for jobs to differentiate their capacities in less rock-paper-scissors but nonetheless highly noticeable ways.

To use the example of flying enemies, Air Anchor should be able to bring a flier down to the ground so melee can assault it, but a Dragoon certainly shouldn't need that; they're a melee job who... nonetheless literally hunt dragons out of the sky. Similarly, just timing a Fell Cleave for when the enemy dips into range to smash its head into the floor just as it hits you would do the trick just fine.

The difference shouldn't be so much in who can do what, but instead in the lenience:

• How responsive is the tool in that situation / for that purpose? [How much preemptive timing is necessary?]
• How broadly can it be used? [How much must one set it up through prior actions, baiting, movement, etc.?]
• How powerful is the effect? How long does it last? [Will it be enough on its own? How quickly must we capitalize on it?]

The problem is that doing more than just lock-outs (i.e., in making X useless and Y thereby comparatively useful) takes a lot more design depth, in a technical/mechanical sense.

Doing things with enemy mass so that Monk and, especially, heavy weapons wielders like DRK and WAR have an advantage in staggering enemies and AST can help lighten them as to let upward-striking skills like Full Thrust, Inner Beast, Shadow Fang, and The Forbidden Chakra punt enemies into airtime... obviously wouldn't be easy even before accounting for the ragdoll physics required.

Still, I'd love to see what a game that looks like it has a decent physics engine for a change, instead of a mockery of one, could do in that regard -- pipedream or no.

Honestly whatever it takes for Jobs to have a bit more identity again, I can't stand how it is right now. Only The Freaking Blue Mage actually has its identity in its own unique way which is hilarious at this point.

Same, though I can't quite agree with even BLU having an identity of its own, unless one's referring to the meta-identity of... being a joke. It has among the worst playflows, via the Moon Flute opener or otherwise, most of its cards are wasted non-options, and it lacks any undermechanics to salvage its eclectic diarrhea of a kit into something cohesive beyond one extra flavor of "Stick the things in the amp windows."

I'd love a real, fleshed out (rather than tossed-out) BLU. I'd enjoy 'd main the hell out of it. But it's not that.

And that doubly sucks because BLU could have been an excuse to offer horizontal progression of sorts to every job: To let Monk follow or mix-and-match particular paths (Shadow or Light, for instance); to let Dragoons find their favored enemies and affinities among draconids; to let Machinists actually build different devices; etc. That could have been a far more fun and player-felt and world-constructing means of customization that'd fit XIV rather than just being another borrowed-but-garbled/bloated WoW mechanic.

Alas, oh well, I guess. This is what the devs have settled upon, and the longer it's left, the less alterable it'll likely ever be.

[Rithy255]

I think the actual problem is more in how the current job design doesn't allow any variations, I'm just going to just talk about raid buffs as a example here, they're one of the biggest issues rn.

As I see it the main issue with Raid Buffs or "team damage" boosting is how formulaic it has become, I'm talking about the 120 raid buffs, which leaves no room for uniqueness you just press it every 120 seconds and forget about it, Old Trick attack for example worked better with Minute jobs but didn't really work poorly with the 120 Jobs, But a way to solve this and make raid buffs feel more useful and unique to the jobs is to 1. Make some "partner" buffs, such as dragon sight/cards, where your choice actually matters, or having buffs outside the 120 window, where it's a actual choice if you hold or not, as sometimes synching up buffs might be better other times it might be better to use the buff and get more uses. Not to mention how forcing 120 raid buffs means that all jobs now must be Burst based, Even if theirs room for uniqueness it's throwing away a lot of jobs that could be less burst based such as Paladin who used to have two phases of burst now it's boring like other tanks in it's burst.

Melee DPS in general, needs to feel more unique imo, at least with Phys ranged you got a mix of proc based jobs and Rotational based jobs, With casters they all feel very different and all have mobility issues, where SMN is more free, BLM suffers from unplanned movement, RDM has Melee aspects and some movement issues like BLM. With Melee Dps instead you have 5 jobs that follow a set rotation, with large boss sizes and no room to optimise, all jobs (apart from drg) having the same raid buffs basically with samurai being "selfish" It's funny how the jobs with the most classes feels like it has the least variety to me