What are the gods for?

[Firlont]

Aside from the fact that anything the wider population believes about the afterlife is completely untrue, I think the one goddess whose adherents have been worst-treated by the information we've learned since the end of 1.0 has to be Menphina.

[sidurgu-12]

Aside from the fact that anything the wider population believes about the afterlife is completely untrue,

Wish they kept that part was keopt vague instead of spelling it out.

[Cleretic]

On the other hand, the fact the afterlife is real and measurable is very funny in a sort of 'fridge logic' way. Like, how long has Sharlayan been sitting on 'we know the answer to the most core unanswerable question that much of abstract thought, theory and religion is based around'? How secret do they keep that to themselves? Is that something you're told when you're elected to the Forum? 'Here's your office, our full meetings are on Thursdays, and here's your key to the Afterlife Observation Deck'.

I've got a video on the afterlife on the backburner (it's quite doable, but I've only got so much time in my day and other videos have proven more interesting), it's interesting that broadly, there's a few cultures that got reasonably close on how the afterlife works. The Amal'jaa probably got the closest, although their details had the advantage of being written after the Aitiascope's stuff; after them the closest is the Dotharl. The Twelve's religion somehow got the existence of the heavens right, but everything else wrong, including how they themselves relate to the heavens.

The only belief that I'd say is completely untrue is actually Garlemald's as it came up in Jullus' Lodestone short story, but it's not clear how much of that they actually believe versus how much of that was just... well, Jullus trying to come up with a culturally-appropriate prayer in about six seconds.

[sidurgu-12]

On the other hand, the fact the afterlife is real and measurable is very funny in a sort of 'fridge logic' way. Like, how long has Sharlayan been sitting on 'we know the answer to the most core unanswerable question that much of abstract thought, theory and religion is based around'? How secret do they keep that to themselves? Is that something you're told when you're elected to the Forum? 'Here's your office, our full meetings are on Thursdays, and here's your key to the Afterlife Observation Deck'.

I've got a video on the afterlife on the backburner (it's quite doable, but I've only got so much time in my day and other videos have proven more interesting), it's interesting that broadly, there's a few cultures that got reasonably close on how the afterlife works. The Amal'jaa probably got the closest, although their details had the advantage of being written after the Aitiascope's stuff; after them the closest is the Dotharl. The Twelve's religion somehow got the existence of the heavens right, but everything else wrong, including how they themselves relate to the heavens.

The only belief that I'd say is completely untrue is actually Garlemald's as it came up in Jullus' Lodestone short story, but it's not clear how much of that they actually believe versus how much of that was just... well, Jullus trying to come up with a culturally-appropriate prayer in about six seconds.

Just to add something, the dortharl got the reincarnation part right but its extremely selective. Anyone who dies in battle while a baby is being born gets reincarnated while everyone else joins the goddess (or god, i cant remember exactly).

[Firlont]

I do wonder, for how long are the Sharlayans going to be permitted to go physically walking around in the collective soul of the planet? The Sharlayans have developed this habit of treating truths and locations that other cultures would consider sacred as their own personal remit, from the depths of the Aetherial Sea to the heavens themselves. I can't help but believe that the only thing shielding the Forum from accusations of sacrilege are obscurity and crisis.

[4clubbedace]

I do wonder, for how long are the Sharlayans going to be permitted to go physically walking around in the collective soul of the planet? The Sharlayans have developed this habit of treating truths and locations that other cultures would consider sacred as their own personal remit, from the depths of the Aetherial Sea to the heavens themselves. I can't help but believe that the only thing shielding the Forum from accusations of sacrilege are obscurity and crisis.

"permitted" literally whos gonna stop them

[MikkoAkure]

Just to add something, the dortharl got the reincarnation part right but its extremely selective. Anyone who dies in battle while a baby is being born gets reincarnated while everyone else joins the goddess (or god, i cant remember exactly).

I don’t remember anything about reincarnation needing to happen RIGHT when a baby is born or having anything to do with being an actual warrior. The wiki says it can happen within a year.

I can’t double-check that part with any possible Dotharl lore dump NPCs since I’m at work, but considering it was a whole thing that Dotharl who didn’t want to be reincarnated would need to commit suicide at a very specific location means that anyone can reincarnate in a reasonable amount of time after death. Otherwise they could do it anywhere when no one in the tribe is heavily pregnant or just not be a warrior.

[Cleretic]

We have one confirmed case of reincarnation with a timeframe, which is a little over eighty years (we don't know Gaia's age but we do know she's a teen). The Dotharl's cycle seems a little fast there, but for all we know that might be circumstances of where they live. Or just them getting that part wrong.

[Iscah]

Indeed – just because we know there is reincarnation in a general sense does not guarantee that the specific Dotharli beliefs about reincarnation are true, or that they are correctly identifying the alleged reincarnations.

[MikkoAkure]

In the quest "Mauci of the Seven Worries" about a Dotharl who doubts he is the reincarnation of his namesake, an NPC you talk to mentions the year thing:

You do not believe Mauci to be the reincarnation of a swordsman? Nonsense! There were no other Dotharl born the year Mauci passed.

The journal notes specifically reflect Kishiligh's comments:

No other Dotharl were born the year the previous Mauci passed, and his poor swordsmanship is not enough to convince anyone that they could be wrong.

IIRC, it turned out that the Maucis before him all changed weapons every reincarnation so nothing is proven.

The whole "being with the goddess thing" Sidurgu mentioned came from a different quest that deals with the House of the Crooked Coin itself.

So she has gone to be one with the Dusk Mother. I have no doubt it is what she wanted, but that knowledge does naught to alleviate the pain in my heart. The House contains a crystal─a sliver of Nhaama's essence. Those who wish to rejoin with the Dusk Mother throw themselves down into the cavern there. This breaks the cycle of reincarnation. The Dusk Mother has always been at the center of my friend's life. The same was true of her previous incarnations. To think, if she had been killed together with her family, her spirit could have moved into the child my sister is about to birth...

We later learned that this place is an Allag contraption that regulates the flow of aether and stopped it from flowing from there to the burn. So there could be something to be said about the soul not making it to the lifestream if parted from the body there.

The Mauci quest mentions a year, but the Maral quest mentions completely breaking the cycle and being with the goddess. I don't think there's nothing specifically mentioned about a time limit that if passed, the soul can't reincarnate among the Dotharl if there are no babies. Maybe the Dotharl believe they're in a queue based on how prominent they are? But so far nothing seems to contradict what we know of reincarnation and it could also be that something supernatural or just the strength of their faith itself influences to be reincarnated as Dotharl again instead of anything else.


Ultimately I like this level of storytelling where something is left open-ended. It doesn't need to be explained and it's more fun to believe in little things like this anyway. There's just enough space to have fun and come up with theories that could actually be possible instead of completely wild guesses.

It gets really tiresome when EVERYTHING is attributed to Allagans or Ancients. To the point where basically every monster and even migratory birds ended up being things other people made.


Late Edit: Remembered that the lore book exists and it mentions that it is indeed Dotharl warriors specifically who will reincarnate and that there is a time limit of a year. If no Dotharl are born that year, they believe the spirit may be reborn in another on the Steppe.