Review of 6.3 Story Content

[Renalt]

Haven't had another thread devoured by the EW debate in a while.

Hey! You should totally join the discord server Robyn made. You'll find the link in like 3 pages back on the Off Topic thread or Robyns Signature. We've been looking forward to you hoping in.

[Midareyukki]

But guess what, so is EW.

Hmm... I mean, I disagree with me seeing it that way because I want to ignore the elephant in the room for the sake of coolness. To me it's just that those points have a lesser impact than the ones on Endwalker.

But from what you're saying, you want people to not be hypocritical and acknowledge there were issues with Shadowbringers as well, and that there aren't only flaws to Endwalker, correct?

imo Shadowbringers did build up a lot of hype and I had a mostly positive outlook on it. However, it was a pretty-self contained story for better or for worse. And unfortunately, it didn't live up to what it could be. The First remains virtually unexplored, with very little understanding of the stuff that remained past key things. I want to know more about what went on in Amh Araeng. I want to know more about Amh Malik and what people lived there. Why places were named after holy people. And I feel like that wasn't explored further. But we spent so much time building the Dwarves up when they felt far more straightforward.
Which thankfully isn't what we get in Endwalker. Every area has a pretty comprehensive story to it and we're told flat-out what things are. Sure, SHB can get the pass that "Oh, well, after 100 apocalyptic years, that knowledge was lost", but we still had a lot more useless information elsewhere than anything that stood up in Amh Araeng. Instead, nah, we just loiter on trolleys. Yaaaay? Endwalker at least tells you what the stuff around it are for, and what little they don't tell you is stuff you can surmise just from exploring. Which I frankly appreciate.

Storywise, yes, it is annoying that Y'shtola died in a dumb way. AGAIN. It is annoying that they're replaying the tired trope of Urianger lying to us. And worse, that reveal was so bloody rushed. They add in the Exarch trying to be evil for no reason, Urianger dropping that he lied out of nowhere with no indication that he had until then... It was just daftly executed. Cute scene overall, was intense, sure... but that moment did make me think if the writers thought things through. But no greater sin is that of Ran'jit. So you beat him... aaaaand where does he go? We just open Vauthry's door like nothing happened, his corpse isn't moved or touched or... like .__. bruh.

Say what you will about Zenos, at least he made sense and he had a presence all around. And in the end, his character had proper progression. Regardless of how we feel about him having returned.

That's what I think of both stories. As for the rest, I still remain by what I said. I feel like Endwalker erred on more aspects, and some were foundational aspects. When SHB erred on foundational aspects, it felt like a graze than a hit.

[TheMightyMollusk]

Hey! You should totally join the discord server Robyn made. You'll find the link in like 3 pages back on the Off Topic thread or Robyns Signature. We've been looking forward to you hoping in.

But that would mean being social. Like, in real time.

[Renalt]

But that would mean being social. Like, in real time.

but also memes...IN REAL TIME!

We also post rabbits and kittens. There was a bird and a danger noodle too.

[Simple_Barghest]

Another thing I'm surprised more people don't have beef with for Shadowbringers is the entire "we've retconned entirely how aether works as a substance, and we're justifying it by saying that every single source of knowledge on the Source is 100% wrong about how aether works, and never came across the right information." Purely to justify the pseudo-zombie apocalypse of sin-eaters and lightwardens.

Edit: And then despite up-ending their metaphysics explanations from prior to justify their light-zombies, they then just. Have none of it matter, as it all ends up playing second fiddle to Emet-Selch / Hades, and instead of having a proper exploration of "Light/Dark good/evil dichotomy wrong?" it's just "oh but light's actually still good because you use it to beat the dark."

[Graeham]

Guild it have the new announcement.

If nothing else the patch story has proven that trusting the nebulous "junior writers" proved to be a mistake. I'm half-tempted to wager a guess at who such individuals (or rather a specific individual) might be but I think I'll refrain from naming names.

It is time. Guild it plan to show true bad guy of the Endwalking. Be the ready.

[Midareyukki]

Another thing I'm surprised more people don't have beef with for Shadowbringers is the entire "we've retconned entirely how aether works as a substance, and we're justifying it by saying that every single source of knowledge on the Source is 100% wrong about how aether works, and never came across the right information." Purely to justify the pseudo-zombie apocalypse of sin-eaters and lightwardens.

Edit: And then despite up-ending their metaphysics explanations from prior to justify their light-zombies, they then just. Have none of it matter, as it all ends up playing second fiddle to Emet-Selch / Hades, and instead of having a proper exploration of "Light/Dark good/evil dichotomy wrong?" it's just "oh but light's actually still good because you use it to beat the dark."

The way I viewed it was that everything needs a balance. An imbalance of any element will always be bad, and SHB actually did try to show what happens if we kept absorbing Light willy-nilly. Emet being an emissary of darkness and being struck down by light, as anime as that may seem, made sense in that he was tempered. Even if we strike him with that leftover Light within us, it was an offensive strike with no intention or measure to bring back balance to his soul. Even if it did, I doubt we'd have changed his mind.

So I saw it less as "Light is suddenly good despite the retcon" and more "Umbrality and Astrality are two necessary poles to the elements. But have too much of anything, and it becomes dangerous." What we did was just "flush out" the excess by pouring all of it into a conjuring of Bravura Padjal. It otherwise would still have been dangerous if left unchecked, and it's by stimulating the elements that we manage to counter the effects of a light excess in the Empty. In fact, we even try twice to bring forth Darkness through E9 and E10. And when we tried to tame Light and Ice through an inexperienced Ryne, it hit the fan real hard and nearly triggered a Light Flood. It all came down to the uses/misuses, and excess of either.

Which makes sense if you think on those aspects. Because they're drawing from FF3's definition of the balance. Whereupon too much Darkness will bring forth the Cloud of Darkness, but too much Light and you get the Cloud of Light. Two sides of the same coin, and either has the potential to be terrible.

However. You are correct regardless. It did strike me as odd as even after all this was established, that Dark could be used for good things and Light could be bad depending on how they were used, that the narrative still tries to pull a Kingdom Hearts on it. "Light and Darkness are part of people's hearts", yet there's no consequence for Light. Here, we do have a consequence, but then the next entries still make use of Darkness in evil applications. So I view it less of a poor retcon, and more so Square not grasping what they were trying to convey.

I just simply don't frame it the way you did, that's all, so I'm justifying why I view it differently. But in broad strokes, yes you are correct in that the story still goes on as if light can't go wrong (when we're SHOWN it can) and that darkness can. Yay for Light actually showing it can have bad applications, but then we get to Hydaelyn and it's like... what's the consequence on becoming a Light goddess, lady?

[Rosenstrauch]

Edit: And then despite up-ending their metaphysics explanations from prior to justify their light-zombies, they then just. Have none of it matter, as it all ends up playing second fiddle to Emet-Selch / Hades, and instead of having a proper exploration of "Light/Dark good/evil dichotomy wrong?" it's just "oh but light's actually still good because you use it to beat the dark."

They wanted to have their cake and eat it too, so they invented Darkness II: Electric Boogaloo.

[Midareyukki]

They wanted to have their cake and eat it too, so they invented Darkness II: Electric Boogaloo.

Darkness within Darkness awaits you, Riku

[Graeham]

Which makes sense if you think on those aspects. Because they're drawing from FF3's definition of the balance. Whereupon too much Darkness will bring forth the Cloud of Darkness, but too much Light and you get the Cloud of Light. Two sides of the same coin, and either has the potential to be terrible.

Both Cloud of Dark and Cloud of Light live in the Cloud Strife is true. But will join the force with the Sephiroth and the Sophia and the SoarSkip to fight the evil Loprabbit and Venar. It part of new OmegaLUL Ultimate in patch 631.