What even is the purpose of all those non melee/blm jobs?

[Tiramu]

From a certain website that everybody loves and hates. It's not exactly rocket science to find.

I was kinda hoping for a link. I wasnt asking to be snarky and am happy to be proven wrong. I was under the impression the larger discrepancy between certain jobs was on launch and has since been patched.

[Mithron]

I was kinda hoping for a link. I wasnt asking to be snarky and am happy to be proven wrong. I was under the impression the larger discrepancy between certain jobs was on launch and has since been patched.

This is just 1 day after the recent patch with balance adjustments.

[Tiramu]

This is just 1 day after the recent patch with balance adjustments.

OK, fair enough. I thought the difference had been patched with all the job adjustments.

However, these are clears which indicates that these jobs are capable of clearing the content, right?

[Yeastyloins]

OK, fair enough. I thought the difference had been patched with all the job adjustments.

However, these are clears which indicates that these jobs are capable of clearing the content, right?

Sure but why make it harder for yourself or your group in general? A group can clear and do reclears in comp consisting of a DRK-GNB-AST-SCH-NIN-BLM-BRD-MCH. But that group would have a significantly easier time doing all of that if instead of MCH that person was playing MNK or SAM provided they are playing those jobs at the same level of skill. That simple job switch allows the group more leeway with their clears, they can afford damage downs, they can afford to wacky stuff happen, they can allow for a person to have a bad day and have their gameplay compromised due to having a bad day at work.

So sure they can clear, but that shouldn't be the only benchmark. Jobs shouldn't be in a place where you join a group and see a MCH or PLD and think "well shit".

[Tiramu]

Sure but why make it harder for yourself or your group in general? A group can clear and do reclears in comp consisting of a DRK-GNB-AST-SCH-NIN-BLM-BRD-MCH. But that group would have a significantly easier time doing all of that if instead of MCH that person was playing MNK or SAM provided they are playing those jobs at the same level of skill. That simple job switch allows the group more leeway with their clears, they can afford damage downs, they can afford to wacky stuff happen, they can allow for a person to have a bad day and have their gameplay compromised due to having a bad day at work.

So sure they can clear, but that shouldn't be the only benchmark. Jobs shouldn't be in a place where you join a group and see a MCH or PLD and think "well shit".

Because the game needs jobs with different skill ceilings and higher ceilings should equal greater performance, if you dont do that then you either end up in a situation where all jobs are too complex for a casual/mid audience, or complex jobs become undesirable.

Imagine if every jobs was as complex as BLM or NIN, they'd make the difficulty too hard.

If all jobs were equal in performance, then why even bother playing BLM? How would pro groups who are going for world firsts feel about a BLM in their group? Might as well have a group full of Dancers and Summoners who can do the same damage with less chance of mistakes on rotations, without the liability of them getting one shotted by a mechanic that other DPS could eat.

[Mithron]

If all jobs were equal in performance, then why even bother playing BLM? How would pro groups who are going for world firsts feel about a BLM in their group? Might as well have a group full of Dancers and Summoners who can do the same damage with less chance of mistakes on rotations, without the liability of them getting one shotted by a mechanic that other DPS could eat.

If only higher complexity jobs do superior damage, then why even bother playing the "ez mode" jobs since they can't compete? That logic cuts both ways. Not being allowed to play a job that you actually like simply because it's "too easy" isn't good design. You can still play complex jobs if it's even in DPS to others, especially if you just like that job.

[Tiramu]

If only higher complexity jobs do superior damage, then why even bother playing the "ez mode" jobs since they can't compete? That logic cuts both ways. Not being allowed to play a job that you actually like simply because it's "too easy" isn't good design. You can still play complex jobs if it's even in DPS to others, especially if you just like that job.

But they can clear, this is a self inflicted problem. Like I said before, you'll just flip the problem if they're all equal. Groups will want DNC over BLM because its safer.

[Ggwppino]

If all jobs were equal in performance, then why even bother playing BLM? How would pro groups who are going for world firsts feel about a BLM in their group? Might as well have a group full of Dancers and Summoners who can do the same damage without the liability.

Why should i play blm, if it is outclassed by rpr, sam, mnk and drg?
Let's be clear, there are some classes with a slightly steeper learning curve than others, which should have 2-3% more than others just to have that gratification. But currently melee are unjustifiably infinitely stronger than ranged. Why can't I play quietly with double ranged just because ranged is decided to suck? Why does any melee do more damage than a brd for example? There is no valid reason right now.

[Tiramu]

Why should i play blm, if it is outclassed by rpr, sam, mnk and drg?
Let's be clear, there are some classes with a slightly steeper learning curve than others, which should have 2-3% more than others just to have that gratification. But currently melee are unjustifiably infinitely stronger than ranged. Why can't I play quietly with double ranged just because ranged is decided to suck? Why does any melee do more damage than a brd for example? There is no valid reason right now.

I dont know the ins and outs of their balancing justifications, but there are clearly 2 groups of jobs, with each all being fairly close to each other. The difference between BLM and RPR is quite small.

The thing with ranged and close combat melee is probably because ranged jobs, provided the player knows mechanics, are less likely to take stuff to the face compared to close melee who generally get hit by stuff more often. Or something like that.

[Aetherdancer]

Why should i play blm, if it is outclassed by rpr, sam, mnk and drg?
Let's be clear, there are some classes with a slightly steeper learning curve than others, which should have 2-3% more than others just to have that gratification. But currently melee are unjustifiably infinitely stronger than ranged. Why can't I play quietly with double ranged just because ranged is decided to suck? Why does any melee do more damage than a brd for example? There is no valid reason right now.

The 2 melee meta seems intended and I'll speculate perhaps why.

There are 5 melee jobs, 3 casters and 3 phys ranged. I can only assume that this is the case because over many years of expansions and community input, melee has been determined to be the most popular DPS role. Probably a safe assumption to make though I'm sure I'll get flogged for making it.

There is some symmetry to having 2 melee which makes itself apparent in parties without 2 melee: the designation of the fake melee. Mechanics like Firestorms of Asphodelos also reinforce the idea that this symmetry is by design.

It may no longer be the case that melee jobs have a harder time than ranged jobs staying safe while keeping uptime, and that's probably exactly why every ranged DPS except dancer got significant buffs yesterday. Apart from that though, melee DPS are still generally more challenging jobs. The only melee with a 2.5 GCD at all times now is Dragoon and they are dense with weaves. Every other melee has a faster GCD at all times except Reaper (which is fast during their burst windows) and they never push the same button twice in a row, they all have positionals which require some level of awareness either of position or of the necessity to push true north, they need to be careful not to accidentally leave melee range, particularly in P6S which requires uptime strats for everyone to keep uptime at all times, and even in P7S (south platform mechanics) and P8S (fourfold fire corners).