Is SE planning to deal with ilvl cheese people?

[Deveryn]

Nothing is really broken, so there's nothing to fix. There are player choices that affect the roulette. As others have noted, ilvl cheese was just a part of it. They also include not unlocking the optional tiers and generally staying away from the roulette. There are other ways to earn tomestones and xp.

[dspguy]

The duty finder player matching algorithm is probably also to blame. In some cases, it works out for the player. Take the following example:
You queue as a DPS for leveling roulette. You are level 89. Someone else queues for Aitiascope. The algorithm will try and start grabbing level 89+ players to match. Your queue number might read 50+ but your queue pops quick since no one else in the queue in front of you is 89+.

I don't know if that algorithm works the same for alliance roulette. If someone opens Copied Factory, will it try to grab players that meet those requirements first? Or is it critical mass? Will it see that someone queued for LotA and just grab 23 more players because anyone in the queue can fill those slots.

[Deveryn]

The duty finder player matching algorithm is probably also to blame. In some cases, it works out for the player. Take the following example:
You queue as a DPS for leveling roulette. You are level 89. Someone else queues for Aitiascope. The algorithm will try and start grabbing level 89+ players to match. Your queue number might read 50+ but your queue pops quick since no one else in the queue in front of you is 89+.

I don't know if that algorithm works the same for alliance roulette. If someone opens Copied Factory, will it try to grab players that meet those requirements first? Or is it critical mass? Will it see that someone queued for LotA and just grab 23 more players because anyone in the queue can fill those slots.

The system definitely puts a priority on first clears. Is it to blame in this situation? I disagree. We only have 13 maximum possibilities and its function is to match people as quickly as possible. We've seen it with dungeon roulette where you can have 4 people with so much available and it can still put you in a low level because it's actually picking at random. This is why the limited leveling option went in so people can maximize the xp gains from the duty itself.

[Midareyukki]

Nothing is really broken, so there's nothing to fix. There are player choices that affect the roulette. As others have noted, ilvl cheese was just a part of it. They also include not unlocking the optional tiers and generally staying away from the roulette. There are other ways to earn tomestones and xp.

But it does point at least to an exploitable flaw in the roulette's design. It's Alliance Raid roulette, yet it's capable of being conditioned by ilv.

You don't see this being done anywhere near as frequently with other roulettes that feature low-level stuff like level roulette or 50-80 roulette. There, the odds of getting ARR/HSW instances are conditioned due to their number in comparison to later expansion instances and the amount of players actually at that level.

Alliance Raid Roulette so far has 12/13 instances, 3 per expansion, far fewer than most other roulettes save Expert and Lv 90. Yet when the same 3 keep showing up with far more frequency than the others, and the fact that people reduce item level specifically to proc them is so noticeable, it does at least show the problem isn't just that there are more people in ARR content/people who haven't unlocked the other instances. And that aspect is exploitable, thus there is something to fix.

[Oizen]

Could also look into nerfing the HP of all the bosses from the HW/SB/SHB alliance raid series.

The Nier bosses go on for way too long imo

[Jeeqbit]

Could also look into nerfing the HP of all the bosses from the HW/SB/SHB alliance raid series.

The Nier bosses go on for way too long imo

Nerfing? They should increase all boss health generally. We skip mechanics too often because there isn't enough, sometimes even in relatively new content. Normal modes put their worst mechanics at the end of the script usually as well.

[wereotter]

Item level cheese isn't the problem.

The problem is that out of 24 players matched in the group, there's a high probability that one of those players is leveling a job under level 60, doing the mandatory CT requirement for MSQ or has never unlocked any of the other Alliance raids.

What SE needs to do is move the 3 CT raids into their own roulette. It's not going to disrupt game balance to add another roulette so players can get bonus XP for jobs they're leveling while separating the one thing that's keeping the Alliance Raid roulette from behaving like an actual roullette instead of a coin toss.

I've loaded into the raids too many times to see other players pop in naked then suddenly equip all their gear (and you can see the discrepancy between the HP changing) to know that this is happening. Additionally most times when I do get crystal tower, there isn't the pop up message that someone is in there for the first time. Sure some people haven't unlocked any other raid series, but it's still creating a problem when people item level cheese when they go to try to Void Ark and realize that they're going to be sitting in queue for over half an hour to get in.

[Moonlite]

This is such a silly argument/request. I have started asking and have option to see when people level. Every CT had someone below 60. Shock, shock, and I just do it for WT a few tries a week. Next why do you think people would que for whatever raid you want anyways? Some people claim CT can be done in 15 mins. I have never seen one that fast. But none of the other ones can be done in even close to the same time. People do the garbage roulette's for rewards. Are they scaled properly, can you guarantee fast run if people drop, can you say the same amount of time and effort has to go into it? SE has some understanding of playerbase, look how much they had to add to MSQ to make people hate do it. The list of problems can go on. So until SE works on the other problems ilvl chs is the least of raid roulette's problems.

[Deveryn]

But it does point at least to an exploitable flaw in the roulette's design. It's Alliance Raid roulette, yet it's capable of being conditioned by ilv.

You don't see this being done anywhere near as frequently with other roulettes that feature low-level stuff like level roulette or 50-80 roulette. There, the odds of getting ARR/HSW instances are conditioned due to their number in comparison to later expansion instances and the amount of players actually at that level.

Alliance Raid Roulette so far has 12/13 instances, 3 per expansion, far fewer than most other roulettes save Expert and Lv 90. Yet when the same 3 keep showing up with far more frequency than the others, and the fact that people reduce item level specifically to proc them is so noticeable, it does at least show the problem isn't just that there are more people in ARR content/people who haven't unlocked the other instances. And that aspect is exploitable, thus there is something to fix.

There's a loophole. I won't deny that. I think it's the only place where such a thing occurs, aside from maybe a handful of people that want to do trials at a lower level. I still believe the resulting problem is hard to pin solely on ilvl cheese. I've done a few roulettes in the past couple months and I haven't seen CT at all. I do remember a time when it was an everyday thing, but I think those people have since moved on, having gotten all their xp. I think it's going to be hard for them to look at the data and see proof of such a thing and harder still for anyone to be able to log a sufficient number of events to say that this is such a big problem. You can have people doing this and still have people show up in the list that are actually under 60. Going back to that time when it did happen more, it was around that time of the WoW flood, so it's likely that we had a lot of true newbs at the time and we still do.

[Midareyukki]

There's a loophole. I won't deny that. I think it's the only place where such a thing occurs, aside from maybe a handful of people that want to do trials at a lower level. I still believe the resulting problem is hard to pin solely on ilvl cheese. I've done a few roulettes in the past couple months and I haven't seen CT at all. I do remember a time when it was an everyday thing, but I think those people have since moved on, having gotten all their xp. I think it's going to be hard for them to look at the data and see proof of such a thing and harder still for anyone to be able to log a sufficient number of events to say that this is such a big problem. You can have people doing this and still have people show up in the list that are actually under 60. Going back to that time when it did happen more, it was around that time of the WoW flood, so it's likely that we had a lot of true newbs at the time and we still do.

It's the same for me. I've been subbed the past two months, and CT raids weren't as large on the probability as Dun Scaith was. I even got a NieR raid once. However, I will point out that people spawning stark naked happened three times. So it does still happen. What I find more heinous isn't that they do it, it's how smarmy they tend to be about it -.-

Of course, getting data on this is borderline impossible. But they could alleviate it with some measure. However, question does remain, whichever measure we put out can make it harder for players who actually do want to unlock the content. Because it wont' just affect CT. CT is fine; it's a part of the MSQ, everyone needs to unlock it. The issue is any instance past it. Ivalice might demand that you unlock it for Bozja, but Bozja isn't mandatory.