People who can't do AOE rotations in 70+ Content

[Shibi]

It's a game that is now being squarely pivoted to attract casual players.

As much as we can bang our heads on the desk and beg people to 'git gud', SE want to make money, lots and lots of money, so the skill bar is set real, real low.

Expect mouth breathers, knuckle draggers, and people who have never played a multiplyer-game before.

[Deceptus]

I had witnessed an alarming increase of this behavior late into Shadowbringers - and then again during Endwalker during the time when I still ran duty roulettes regularly. It is absolutely unacceptable to not know when to use AoE vs single target that late in the game, there is no excusing it. I would sooner run trusts than carry someone who doesn't grasp these fundamentals, because I don't want to be part of the reason that enabled them to cause problems for someone else later on down the line.

There has to be higher expectations for FFXIV players. "Normal" content is several steps below Easy Mode at this point in all aspects outside 8man raids.

Trusts are designed to be not as efficient as normal players should be to incentivize playing with other people.

When your group goes slower than the trust would have. . . . Well, that is a DPS problem, a YOU problem (collective you, not you personally). Their entire job is making things die relatively quickly.

And yes, leveling every job to 90 I've experienced that relatively frequently when I was leveling my tanks. Basically, see point 3 of my sig.

[TheMightyMollusk]

It's a game that is now being squarely pivoted to attract casual players.

As much as we can bang our heads on the desk and beg people to 'git gud', SE want to make money, lots and lots of money, so the skill bar is set real, real low.

Expect mouth breathers, knuckle draggers, and people who have never played a multiplyer-game before.

As a filthy casual myself, there's a difference between "casual" and "bad".

[Zebraoracle]

If you queue using duty finder you should have zero expectations. Put your own group together so those of your ilk can stay together. I am sure the people in duty finder won't miss you.

Absolutely not. At 70+, you should know the basics of how your job works (barring sage and reaper obviously, but even still you should know what an AoE ability is if you CAN unlock those two jobs). Having the most basics of expectations is not wrong or mean or whatever, it's *expecting people in a group based game mode to contribute to the group and not make things harder for everyone*.

Also, lol @ "I am sure the people in duty finder won't miss you." Absolutely lol. What a take.

[Midareyukki]

Trusts are designed to be not as efficient as normal players should be to incentivize playing with other people.

When your group goes slower than the trust would have. . . . Well, that is a DPS problem, a YOU problem (collective you, not you personally). Their entire job is making things die relatively quickly.

And yes, leveling every job to 90 I've experienced that relatively frequently when I was leveling my tanks. Basically, see point 3 of my sig.

I agree. I don't mind having to heal, and I don't expect pitch-perfect robots.

But if you're a DPS that doesn't AoE or a tank that refuses to press cooldowns and makes me pull heals out of my ass just to keep up, how is that fair for me? "Because you queued up to play with them"? Alright, so if I decide next time that I just "don't want to heal" (or just outright can't) because I can't keep up with those tanks, it's fine, right? Because they didn't ask to queue up with me, and can't have any control over whether I can keep up with their mistakes or not. I'm not a robot either.

Why is it so okay for all those others to force me to waste my time and make an effort, when they themselves don't make one?

Because I have to respect how they play? I do respect how they play, but if I go to a chess match and my opponent insists on playing chess like one would play checkers, what else am I meant to think? I queued up for chess, not checkers. You can make all the mistakes you want on chess, that's fine, but checkers isn't the point of the game. And tolerating people doing that just makes the problem worse; it's troll logic.

It's a tank's job to press defensive cooldowns, it's a DPS's job to deal damage, and if there is healing in need (particularly if someone's gonna die from the lack of it), healers should be on the lookout. That's why it's called a "role". I'm not playing my role if I refuse to do it. I'm not playing the game, if that's the case.

Otherwise why do you think we have a "Tales from Duty Finder" thread going on? By those standards, those people are wrong in complaining. After all, they knew what they queued for, they should be expecting people to not do the bare minimum of dodging the bright orange things or bothering to DPS down mobs.

My old FC mate was right. If Square made a class with nothing but two buttons to press, people would still find a way to be bad at it. And from what I can tell, a lot of you would defend that.

[Payadopa]

I'm not saying I disagree, but then again how do you enforce such behaviour? Are people who are tired after work and just want to unwind not allowed to play because they didn't read the 'XIV AoE manual'? And that's only one example out of many.

You can all argue until you're blue in the face, that reality won't change and it's a bit silly to expect otherwise. DF is and has always been a grab bag of skill that you use for the convenience of finding people automatically. That's all it is. If you don't like it there is always PF.

[Bsrking5]

And this is why ex in mentor is a nightmare. Because they same people who actively refuse advice to get better que for ex in duty finder with the same mentality.

[Wolwosh]

I think the trick is to just leave if it becomes to obnoxious.
I don't expect much from people, especially while they are leveling, but when its causing several wipes because the Tank hasn't figured out to use CD's at level 90 or a 15 min dungeon turns into 40 minutes because I have 2 DPS doing their 1 2 3 single target rotation on a braindead job like Machinist when I pull 15 adds I'd rather take the penalty and craft for 30 minutes to make some gil and try again after.

[AwesomeJr44]

We shouldn't expect everyone to be gamer gods, but if you're not pulling your weight (and your weight is pretty damn small in 'normal' content) you're not meeting what should be the bare minimum. Period. If that upsets you, you're probably one of the people who likes to throw their weight onto someone else's shoulders.

If you're a brand new player in Sastasha, fine. I'll carry you. You're brand new and have no idea what to do. If you're dead weight in Holminster Switch, get off my back and do your fair share.

If you queue using duty finder you should have zero expectations. Put your own group together so those of your ilk can stay together. I am sure the people in duty finder won't miss you.

"People should be allowed to force others to carry their dead weight, and if you don't like that, leave." - Reap00

I'm not saying I disagree, but then again how do you enforce such behaviour?

You don't pick up their dead weight, and you let them learn that you're not going to pick them off the ground and carry them to the finish line.

Are people who are tired after work and just want to unwind not allowed to play because they didn't read the 'XIV AoE manual'?

If they're just tired from work, they still should be able to spam an AOE. If they can't, they're not just tired from work, they're incompetent too.

[Jin-]

Punish those people by just spamming combo starter so it will take even longer. Make sure to have 2nd monitor on and some good video on it.