Who knew the 6.15 Omega Quests… (Spoilers)

[Lauront]

Like, I admit I was maybe being a little extreme in saying that it 'fixes' Endwalker's thematic and tonal problems, but it does feel like it at least legitimizes a negative response to it in-universe. It is now 'valid' for the WoL to think Venat was wrong; that ground has been conceded, even if it doesn't fix the sense of being railroaded into loving her in the original work. (And yeah, the codex entry does kinda contradict that, but it's worth remembering that it came out first and was probably written just after the release of the game, so...)

There are definitely ways it could have been better, but I really do wonder what some people's expectations are here, you know? From the beginning, it's been obvious that the main scenario team isn't going to go back and literally rewrite a finished game, or turn around and directly contradict it by making Venat an explicit villain in the post-expac content. That sort of thing just doesn't happen. It still bums me out when I think about the repercussions of Endwalker on the setting and what could've been, but what's done is done, and all one can reasonably hope for at this point is for the writers to say "I hear you and recognize there was an issue" and to make conciliatory gestures with the story going forward. And like, in that regard, I don't think it's wrong to take this quest as at least a potentially positive sign? Especially since we still have a fair bit of EW 'epilogue content' to get through.

For all their flaws, this is the same writing team that created Shadowbringers, the success of which was the reason I was so let down by Endwalker to begin with. I do feel like I owe them a little good faith in response to a step in the right direction. It does kinda feel like an increasing amount of people in these threads are completely despondent about the future of the story and only really here for the catharsis of complaining about EW, and though I obviously do get it, it doesn't really feel productive to me at this point.

For my part, I don't think it's at all necessary to try and turn her into an explicit villain at this point. I never wanted that out of her, it wasn't how I expected they'd deal with her, as they had plenty of scope to deal with her as a well-intentioned ideologue (e.g. Yunalesca), which is what I think we got in large part anyway, regardless of the narrative treatment surrounding her in 6.0.

My far greater issue with it was the way they attempted to legitimise the sundering. It had to happen for the story to take place as it did, which I accept. What I am far less fond of is the suggestion that, over and above this, it was either necessary (i.e. the ancients would not find a way to deal with it even if told the full truth; I don't think the story even managed to make this case) or the notion that it was the best possible outcome (the twaddle about "utopias", "perfection", strawmen to this effect, etc.), coupled with not really depicting what it entailed.

They somewhat walked back the former in the Q&A, by stipulating it was ultimately a function of her beliefs, and sort of ameliorated the latter by depicting it, albeit in another IP... but to be frank, I'd like to see something a bit firmer in-game, even if it amounts to a codex entry clearing it up a bit, or something along those lines. Something quite different to what we actually got in the entry about her, in the self-same codex (with the unfortunate insinuation it was authored by the MC), but I'll take your point that it was probably written just post-release. While I wouldn't mind an AU (especially as it'd be the only opportunity to see more of their world) it isn't essential to me as it is but one way of achieving the same thing.

More importantly, what I would like is for them to avoid utilising any remaining story arcs tangential to the ancients to try double down on their treatment as being doomed no matter what, or a continuation of the "aren't they a bit scary?" side glancing, and while the Omega quest certainly does suggest they've learnt from their mistakes (particularly in allowing for the character to have varied perspectives on a situation, even where they benefited), it remains to be seen how Pandaemonium and Aglaia conclude, as these are epilogues to the 6.0 story. For all my other issues with the game and wish that this wasn't the story we ended up getting, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt, but I won't lie - this is in a very tempered and muted sense.

[Packetdancer]

My far greater issue with it was the way they attempted to legitimise the sundering. It had to happen for the story to take place as it did, which I accept. What I am far less fond of is the suggestion that, over and above this, it was either necessary (i.e. the ancients would not find a way to deal with it even if told the full truth; I don't think the story even managed to make this case) or the notion that it was the best possible outcome (the twaddle about "utopias", "perfection", strawmen to this effect, etc.), coupled with not really depicting what it entailed.

I admit, I never read it as that the Sundering was in and of itself a legitimate choice -- or even a particularly good one -- but rather a move largely of desperation (at least in the original timeline). My understanding is basically:

1. World is ending. Half of the population of Eitherys is sacrificed to create Zodiark.
2. Zodiark saves Eitherys by holding the Final Days at bay, but the planet is barren.
3. Half the remaining population of Eitherys is sacrificed to give Zodiark enough juice to make the world verdant and filled with life once more.
4. As part of this, new 'lesser' races come into being. (E.g., the races we now see: Hyur, miqo'te, etc.)
5. The Convocation -- and presumably others -- go "Cool! Sentient living things! That's a bunch of juicy aether; we can sacrifice all of them to bring back the folks we killed off to create and empower Zodiark. Everybody wins!"
6. Some Ancients point out that no, not everybody wins, because they are kind of opposed to sacrificing other races. Races who may lack the means to fight back against the power of the Ancients -- much less Zodiark -- but demonstrably would prefer to, y'know, not be wiped out as a mass sacrifice. Those serving Zodiark do not care and are prepared to do so regardless, because Tempering.
7. Hydaelyn suplexes Zodiark in a last-ditch effort to try to stop him and his followers from killing off all the new 'lesser' non-Ancient races. The resulting bodyslam Sunders everything: Zodiark, Hydaelyn herself, and the entirety of Eitherys. That said, the fragmentary bits of Zodiark continue to hold their seal against the Final Days.
8. The 'lesser' races, being aetherically 'smaller', slip through the cracks as it were; some survive the Sundering, albeit are scattered across the shards. The Ancients, being far more aether-dense, also get Sundered along with the world. (Though the Sundered pieces of their souls begin to reincarnate in the surviving "lesser" races across the various shards.)
9. The three surviving members of the Convocation hatch a plan to smash all the shards back together and resume where they left off.
10. Lots of stuff happens for tens of thousands of years (if not longer).
11. Eventually, a reincarnated and semi-congealed fragment of Venat's protege and successor travels back in time to before all of this, telling Venat what has happened/will happen and basically locking the events into place as a loop; now Hydaelyn seemingly does this because it's "what has to happen".

I admit that last one is the part that rings "off" to me; yes, you could assume that changing the past might obliterate the future and thus prevent the WoL from going back and giving the information necessary to change the approach to the Final Days, causing paradox. Except that we know from Shadowbringers that things and memories from one timeline can survive a shift to another; the Eighth Umbral Calamity has not happened and -- presumably -- now never will, but the timeline in the wake of that Calamity sure had an impact on the First and the Source via Shadowbringers.

(Though admittedly, changing the past so far back, and causing the world to never be Sundered -- and thus many people we care about to potentially never exist in the first place -- definitely brings its own set of thorny moral questions. So perhaps Venat/Hydaelyn felt obligated to see the timeline through on the original path specifically to preserve those lives...?)

That said, I certainly don't disagree that they probably could've found a better solution in theory, but I suspect it would've required the Convocation not to get themselves Tempered by trying to make a god in the first place; once that had happened, they probably weren't inclined to listen to reason any longer, if said 'reason' went against what Zodiark perceived as 'the will of the people'.