I'm not paying $15 a month just to lose the lottery every time

[LianaThorne]

It's honestly a bit crazy how MMOs that are still going strong for 10-15 years have more extensive features than FF does. LOTRO is a really good example of this with their premium housing set up (buy as many houses as you want), standard housing with upkeep for f2p players and extensive events that make FF's look like they were thrown together in under an hour.

PSO2 is another example with one of the best glamour/fashion systems out there and their emote system is probably the best with hundreds to pick from and you can even sync your movements with another player without having to try 10 times to get the timing right like FF. They also have upgradable instanced housing.

SWTOR isn't in the best spot right now but their housing system should also be used as a reference for how to do it properly since you can own multiple strongholds.

There isn't an excuse anymore. Devs needs to just admit that the way they're doing housing isn't going to work and rework it to be instanced (even if it means ripping housing apart and rebuilding it), along with the handful of other things that are genuinely confusing as to why we dont have them.

If other games have been doing it for a literal decade, there's no reason why they can't provide the same.

[Striker44]

It's honestly a bit crazy how MMOs that are still going strong for 10-15 years have more extensive features than FF does. LOTRO is a really good example of this with their premium housing set up (buy as many houses as you want), standard housing with upkeep for f2p players and extensive events that make FF's look like they were thrown together in under an hour.

PSO2 is another example with one of the best glamour/fashion systems out there and their emote system is probably the best with hundreds to pick from and you can even sync your movements with another player without having to try 10 times to get the timing right like FF. They also have upgradable instanced housing.

SWTOR isn't in the best spot right now but their housing system should also be used as a reference for how to do it properly since you can own multiple strongholds.

There isn't an excuse anymore. Devs needs to just admit that the way they're doing housing isn't going to work and rework it to be instanced (even if it means ripping housing apart and rebuilding it), along with the handful of other things that are genuinely confusing as to why we dont have them.

If other games have been doing it for a literal decade, there's no reason why they can't provide the same.

Underlying game engines and coding vary immensely from game-to-game. And I'm not quite sure using LOTRO or SWTOR as examples of games "still going strong" is a good idea (I'm not familiar enough with PSO2 to know its real status). SWTOR is down to just a few servers, and LOTRO just announced closing another of their original world servers a few weeks ago.

[Jojoya]

Underlying game engines and coding vary immensely from game-to-game. And I'm not quite sure using LOTRO or SWTOR as examples of games "still going strong" is a good idea (I'm not familiar enough with PSO2 to know its real status). SWTOR is down to just a few servers, and LOTRO just announced closing another of their original world servers a few weeks ago.

But their downfall generally has nothing to do with their housing. It's other problems with the game, frequently monetization systems since most are F2P, that are usually to blame. If players feel like their progress are too heavily gated by paywalls, they quit so only the whales are left. The whales start feeling lonely for lack of other players and abused since they're footing a disproportionately high percentage of the game costs and they start quitting.

You can look at something like RIFT that's probably surviving in good part because of its housing system, which is one of the best to be found in a MMO.

Also, Josh Strife Hayes just did an interview with one of the Path of Exiles developers (it's sort of a combination ARPG/MMO if you're not familiar with the game but they've got smaller limits on how many players can be in a zone at a time than most other MMOs). Having a small player base doesn't necessarily kill a game. The goal of PoE was to have 10,000 players when they were first developing it. They've got significantly more than that but the developer said that even if their player base dropped back down to that 10,000, they'd keep the game running.

It's not the total number of players or servers that determine if a game is good for you. It's whether you have enough to play with when you're ready to play and if there is content you enjoy. That's why all those old MMOs keep going - they still have the content and enough players to keep those who really enjoy those games happy.

[SnowVix]

Underlying game engines and coding vary immensely from game-to-game. And I'm not quite sure using LOTRO or SWTOR as examples of games "still going strong" is a good idea (I'm not familiar enough with PSO2 to know its real status). SWTOR is down to just a few servers, and LOTRO just announced closing another of their original world servers a few weeks ago.

SWTOR is going to coast for quite a while at the 5 existing servers (2 US, 1 EU-EN, 1 EU-FR, 1 EU-DE), though. I've watched other games go through the same Freemium model and they get an easy decade+, and SWTOR is not only Star Wars, it's the last bastion of Legends (formerly Expanded Universe) content.

[Puksi]

TESO housing makes FFXIV housing look terrible, too. Blended into actual game zones, not wards, you can buy every house in the game, each one is a unique structure, and a lot of the big houses are more legit like towns. Friends can visit, furniture can be floated and rotated any which way without shelf-floating tricks, furniture cap doubles when you are subbed, but doesn't penalize you when you are not. And they never demo.

[ShantiiElorei]

Fun fact, LOTRO's housing is neighbourhoods just like FFXIV. The only difference is that when one fills up, another one is automatically created. The downsides are that you have limited housing hooks and you can't place stuff freely, much less than what we have currently in our housing. SWTOR is instanced housing with a lot more space for things, which is nice.

Ah I didn't know about that limitation with LOTRO's housing. If it were a choice between more non-instanced wards being auto-created when one fills up but limited item placement, vs. instanced housing with FFXIV's current flexible item placement, I'd definitely prefer the latter. Enough wards for everyone who wants one to get a house in the current non-instanced districts would be amazing, but yeah I assume there is some technical limitation that has so far prevented that or they would've done it already. So at this point, if that can't be done, I'd happily take instanced housing. It's better than NO house.

I see these threads all the time, get an apartment and a fc room, is a lot you can do with them, and one day you might get lucky on house its what i did for years. Gardening also isn't as fun or good for gil as some people think.

But the fact is that some people just really want to be ABLE to garden, and decorate outdoors. Whether you personally find it fun or not. And you can't do either of those things in an apartment or an FC room (sure you can use the garden plots of your FC but you gotta share those with everyone else and often they are in use by others). Presumably you agree apartments/fc rooms aren't enough for some people since it sounds like you DID keep trying to get a house and eventually got one? It's just kinda...funny when people who already DO have a house tell those venting about not being able to get one that houses aren't that big of a deal/aren't that much better. If you really think that, sell your house so someone who does really want one can get it. XD

It's perfectly reasonable for people to want access to game systems that exist. Some care about it more than others, and it sucks that those who really care are still locked out because of limited availability.

And "one day you might get lucky" doesn't apply anymore because demolition is still deactivated, so once all current plots fill up (probably within the next bidding cycle or two), that's it, no more opportunities for anyone else. Ever. Unless they turn demolition back on, add more wards, or someone randomly decides to get rid of their own house (unlikely).

TESO housing makes FFXIV housing look terrible, too. Blended into actual game zones, not wards, you can buy every house in the game, each one is a unique structure, and a lot of the big houses are more legit like towns. Friends can visit, furniture can be floated and rotated any which way without shelf-floating tricks, furniture cap doubles when you are subbed, but doesn't penalize you when you are not. And they never demo.

Can everyone who wants one get a house in that game? Or is it limited like in FFXIV? I wonder how they pull that off...much smaller player base I assume?

[Puksi]

Can everyone who wants one get a house in that game? Or is it limited like in FFXIV? I wonder how they pull that off...much smaller player base I assume?

A few of the large houses are locked behind zone achievements, but everyone can have every house. I think I'm up to 30 or 40 so far. I'm not sure about the comparisons of playerbase size, aside from TESO always being crowded everytime I play, and zones are always active. But considering their housing is all instanced, they could have peak WoW numbers and not have an issue.

https://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fext...Player+Housing Scroll down for a list of the houses and preview pictures. Their housing community seems pretty active and very enthusiastic.

I said in another thread a little while back, I take issues with some things in the game itself, but never in the worldbuilding, lore and housing.

[ShantiiElorei]

A few of the large houses are locked behind zone achievements, but everyone can have every house. I think I'm up to 30 or 40 so far. I'm not sure about the comparisons of playerbase size, aside from TESO always being crowded everytime I play, and zones are always active. But considering their housing is all instanced, they could have peak WoW numbers and not have an issue.

https://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fext...Player+Housing Scroll down for a list of the houses and preview pictures. Their housing community seems pretty active and very enthusiastic.

I said in another thread a little while back, I take issues with some things in the game itself, but never in the worldbuilding, lore and housing.

Ohhh I misunderstood! I thought it was non-instanced housing based on them being blended into actual game zones. That makes more sense then if they are still instanced.

[Puksi]

Oh, yeah, I meant they have no dedicated housing wards. You can see the houses in the zones, but "entering" them takes you to your own instance.

[Amelimie]

It's just kinda...funny when people who already DO have a house tell those venting about not being able to get one that houses aren't that big of a deal/aren't that much better. If you really think that, sell your house so someone who does really want one can get it. XD

It's perfectly reasonable for people to want access to game systems that exist. Some care about it more than others, and it sucks that those who really care are still locked out because of limited availability.

And "one day you might get lucky" doesn't apply anymore because demolition is still deactivated, so once all current plots fill up (probably within the next bidding cycle or two), that's it, no more opportunities for anyone else. Ever. Unless they turn demolition back on, add more wards, or someone randomly decides to get rid of their own house (unlikely).

What you are saying is right, but point am making is you can at least make cool rooms with fc room and apartment which is better than nothing at all.