Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

[Nizzi]

Sometimes I have to refresh my DoT on TWO targets. I feel enormously challenged by that. Please remove healer DoTs next expansion.

Watch them do this for every healer except SGE and then people will unironically say "SGE has more complex healer DPS than every other healer, if you want to DPS more go play SGE" lmao

[Wyssahtyn]

Wonder what the bets are on the director saying something along the lines of "go play Criterion/Variant dungeons" in the near future

[Selvokaz]

i think the players should engage in a game of 24 while playing jobs to stay engaged.

[MellowMink]

This thread deserves to be pinned honestly; it won’t, but it falling onto later pages gives the developers another excuse to ignore massive healer outcries.

[Ryoutoshi]

It's important to note that not every healer cries about the same thing.

For example, I mained healer until StB. Yea SCH got it's gameplay gutted but that's fine. My issue was what I got in return. All of my missing skills that I had fun using got replaced with 1 aoe. Sure. What's the aoe? I slap the ground and make a circle that lasts 2 seconds and looks pretty lame. If I got some cool shit instead in the animation I would probably be fine. If I had gotten AST's Gravity or something never would've heard from me.

1 single target attack cause you just want me on 1 button? Cool. Can I at least get the melee pvp treatment? Turn my 1 button into something that cycles between 3 animations. They don't even need to do different potencies. Again, the rule of cool is a powerful thing. I think healing is cool.

Before, I got my cool from running through my SCH hotbars on controller which made me feel accomplished. But considering SMN is dirt easy and great fun, I can be appeased by making the replacement shiny enough. I still like being a healer. I like being awesome more. And I could care less how that awesomeness comes about.

For every healer wanting for shit to go wrong, there's a dps hoping their healer doesn't let them get two shot because they (the dps) slipped up once. Every extra raid wide is another chance for a healer not as good as another to let that dps with 2vuns die because they weren't topped off in preparation. Every addition of constant dot damage means every vun becomes a constant worry for the healer and the dps who's relying on them. This of course assumes the healer isn't playing god already and deciding their not worth the split focus (guilty). You can say they should not get vuns. But then why should they be expected not to make mistakes in content meant to be casual. And if you agree with that, then how is telling someone to play higher content a bad thing? And if that isn't your issue then his (Yoshi-Ps) comment doesn't have anything to do with you and we return to, "not every healer cries about the same things".

I feel for you (this thread) but I can't say I'm on your side. I run Dun Scaith as a healer if I want to carry someone. The current alliance raid is pretty good for some full party recoveries as well. I'd be fine with just more effort into what I have left. I agree with that response for a specific subset of healers but the rest including myself shouldn't really be up in arms about it. Like most things, it makes sense for some and not for others. I play GNB now because that thing is like a melee off-healer and saving some random dps from death every 30 sec or so feels nice while developing hand cramps.

There is no easy answer for healers on mass and acting like there is only cheapens the discussion even if you have a good point.

[Rilifane]

It's important to note that not every healer cries about the same thing.

For example, I mained healer until StB. Yea SCH got it's gameplay gutted but that's fine. My issue was what I got in return. All of my missing skills that I had fun using got replaced with 1 aoe. Sure. What's the aoe? I slap the ground and make a circle that lasts 2 seconds and looks pretty lame. If I got some cool shit instead in the animation I would probably be fine. If I had gotten AST's Gravity or something never would've heard from me.

1 single target attack cause you just want me on 1 button? Cool. Can I at least get the melee pvp treatment? Turn my 1 button into something that cycles between 3 animations. They don't even need to do different potencies. Again, the rule of cool is a powerful thing. I think healing is cool.

Before, I got my cool from running through my SCH hotbars on controller which made me feel accomplished. But considering SMN is dirt easy and great fun, I can be appeased by making the replacement shiny enough. I still like being a healer. I like being awesome more. And I could care less how that awesomeness comes about.

For every healer wanting for shit to go wrong, there's a dps hoping their healer doesn't let them get two shot because they (the dps) slipped up once. Every extra raid wide is another chance for a healer not as good as another to let that dps with 2vuns die because they weren't topped off in preparation. Every addition of constant dot damage means every vun becomes a constant worry for the healer and the dps who's relying on them. This of course assumes the healer isn't playing god already and deciding their not worth the split focus (guilty). You can say they should not get vuns. But then why should they be expected not to make mistakes in content meant to be casual. And if you agree with that, then how is telling someone to play higher content a bad thing? And if that isn't your issue then his (Yoshi-Ps) comment doesn't have anything to do with you and we return to, "not every healer cries about the same things".

I feel for you (this thread) but I can't say I'm on your side. I run Dun Scaith as a healer if I want to carry someone. The current alliance raid is pretty good for some full party recoveries as well. I'd be fine with just more effort into what I have left. I agree with that response for a specific subset of healers but the rest including myself shouldn't really be up in arms about it. Like most things, it makes sense for some and not for others. I play GNB now because that thing is like a melee off-healer and saving some random dps from death every 30 sec or so feels nice while developing hand cramps.

There is no easy answer for healers on mass and acting like there is only cheapens the discussion even if you have a good point.

Do you know what a SAM does that doesn't want to learn and play the correct Hagakure loop? They don't do it. (Guilty)
Do you know what a BLM does that doesn't like the tighter timing that comes with Transpose lines? They don't use them. (Sometimes guilty)
Do you what MNKs did that didn't want to learn the correct branching combos? Not use them and instead use 123456 on repeat. (Guilty)

If the healing requirements don't get increased as they've stated they won't, that's one thing. But pretending that obscene amount of downtime doesn't exist for many players by also refusing to give us decent downtime gameplay and then telling these players to play Ultimate (where it's the same 1 button spam btw) or go do old alli raids that offer no real reward for running them ad nauseum in hopes of getting a bad party so they can be engaged is tone-deaf, dismissive and ignorant of alternatives.
Because you could absolutely give healers a more engaging dps rotation for downtime and if someone isn't playing healer well enough to manage that they can simply not use it and instead stick to 1 dot/ 1 filler while learning instead of going the full route. Like players of other classes do that are not up for certain intricaties of their rotation.
The beauty of better downtime options like more dps buttons is that it's entirely up to the devs how much of a dps increase using 6 buttons over 1 dot/ 1 nuke is. They could design it in a way that a full and perfectly executed 6 button rotation is only a 2% dps increase over just using 1 dot/ 1 filler after the rework and I guarantee you that the currently bored healers would do it. They do things for less gain than that (*cough*30potencygainDissipation*cough*). While the learning players could still contribute with quite well if they stick to the very basics.

If an entire role can only be engaging in the topmost endgame content or old content with a hilariously bad party for many players than something is seriously wrong with the role - NOT the player. I expect better from a multimillion dollar company than trying to blame the player for their bad role design.

[Rolder50]

This thread deserves to be pinned honestly; it won’t, but it falling onto later pages gives the developers another excuse to ignore massive healer outcries.

Just gotta come in every now and then and give it a lil bump.

[Ryoutoshi]

If the healing requirements don\\'t get increased as they\\'ve stated they won\\'t, that\\'s one thing. But pretending that obscene amount of downtime doesn\\'t exist for many players by also refusing to give us decent downtime gameplay and then telling these players to play Ultimate (where it\\'s the same 1 button spam btw) or go do old alli raids that offer no real reward for running them ad nauseum in hopes of getting a bad party so they can be engaged is tone-deaf, dismissive and ignorant of alternatives.
Because you could absolutely give healers a more engaging dps rotation for downtime and if someone isn\\'t playing healer well enough to manage that they can simply not use it and instead stick to 1 dot/ 1 filler while learning instead of going the full route. Like players of other classes do that are not up for certain intricaties of their rotation.
The beauty of better downtime options like more dps buttons is that it\\'s entirely up to the devs how much of a dps increase using 6 buttons over 1 dot/ 1 nuke is. They could design it in a way that a full and perfectly executed 6 button rotation is only a 2% dps increase over just using 1 dot/ 1 filler after the rework and I guarantee you that the currently bored healers would do it. They do things for less gain than that (*cough*30potencygainDissipation*cough*). While the learning players could still contribute with quite well if they stick to the very basics.

Why does it seem like you agree with me but don\\'t want to admit it?

You just mentioned how there\\'s one issue, then there are others. You also expressed the same issue I have (the downtime being boring) but with different solutions that would be satisfying to you.

My point was that there are multiple issues affecting healers and one response does not get directed to every single one of them. All of those reason are valid. Would it make sense for the response we got to be applied to each one of those? No. But it is a good answer to 1 of the healer\\'s issues. If your one of those, maybe you should listen. If your not (which you don\\'t seem like it since I\\'m pretty sure we\\'re agreeing right now), then his response wasn\\'t to you or about you. You and I should relax because there is no reason to believe that our point isn\\'t still being considered. Maybe bandwagon on a thread more focused on the issue at hand instead of one just railing at 1 response to 1 issue that not even ours? Pretty sure not everyone here even falls into the demographic that response would affect. All I\\'m saying.

[MellowMink]

The forums still have this weird glitch where previewing posts with apostrophes causes multiple backslash characters to appear before them; been noticing this for months now, but it just happened again.

[MintnHoney]

You know what, this perspective on the recent live letter gave me a little hope that life can be good after all.
https://youtu.be/KwhPk8fPzdE


(just not for healers)