Is the "healing portion" of healers hitting a wall in EW?

[Raven2014]

False. Those players never adopted that mentality. They always had that mentality. Optimizers, or META. They do it with all roles in the game, including healing. We can't argue with them either, can we? How can you when 2+2=4 is their argument? We try with 2+2 =/= fun, but it does not compute. It does however, lead to bitter and spiteful healers and the dichotomy within the community.

It's totally computed.

- Selfish DPS does not take away things from others people.
- Selfish tanks used to take away things from other people, until they did away with the whole enmity management.
- Selfish healers take away things from other people the most, and giving them oGCD allows them to take less.

Basically, to me they're fixing healer pretty much the way they're fixing tank, let people greed their heart out without having to compromise their intended role. And before anyone jump in and say "but all classes can mess up mechanic if they tunnel vision!". Yes, but that's the point, while all role carry the same baseline responsibility, healers is the role with the extra baggage.

Greeding is the exact opposite of what they want healers doing. They even gave us an ability to yank DPS players who are about to greed themselves to an early grave because for some reason they have decided that shaving off a second or two is worth risking adding a minute or two. Healer oGCD are there to support the healer. That's it.

I'm not sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me here. It sounds like you agree, but want a more rosy interpretation of it. Yes, they don't want healer to greed, but preaching that ain't gonna change anything. If it's a choice between an attack and a heal, a lot healers would choose the attack and pray the co-healer will do it in their place. The oGCD eliminate that choice, so a healer can still attack and heal at the same time.

Like I said, it's very clear they're making healer go the way of tank, and how they harmonizing all 3 roles toward DPS. Tank used to have to pick a choice between DPS or tanking (emnity&damage reduction), which lead to a lot of shitty tanks, so SE eliminated that. Healers have to pick a choice between DPS and Heal (call it greed, meta, optimization idc, same difference to me), which lead to a lot of shitty healers, and we can clearly see they're removing that choice gradually.

This is why I said it's a rabithole. Players like to blame Dev, and Dev like to blame the players, but the fact is the class is what it is because it's meld to accommodate the player's desire.

Now, don't get me totally wrong. I am not entirely in opposition to adding some DPS skills. I think they are a fine way to reward the healer, and the party. Skills like Misery and Astrodyne are absolutely wonderful additions to the healer kits, and this definitely needs to be extended to the other healers, particularly SCH. But offensive GCD skills that are a normal part of the rotation will never come back. Like, ever.

I'm one of the (very?) few on this forum against the idea of healer having a DPS rotation, and would only accept it if it's designed in a away that the DPS and healing channel do not interfere with each others for reason I had stated above. In my experience, if they are to be again given the choice between DPS or heal, the majority of healers I ran into can not be trust to make the responsible choice.

[Rolder50]

I'd agree that the healing kits don't really have anywhere to go. Even as it stands now, healers have far more tools then are needed to deal with 99% of gameplay, with maybe only one or two phases in some ultimate fights actually requiring full use of the kit. The logical next step would be to add DPS actions instead and perhaps tie them in with the healing kits in some form, like how Lilies interact with DPS on White Mage, more stuff like that. After all, it's pretty clear they don't want to making the healing part harder, so it's either add DPS actions or just let healers languish in the trash bin.

[QooEr]

Understand that this is all anecdotal, ok? I can't speak for Ultimates, but I've had my entire healing kit exhausted during W2W pulls in dungeons.

my point is that the basic heals are sufficient. you can do a w2w pull with just cure ii, and you can clear any heal check in the game spamming medica. look at blue mage, they have like 4 healing skills and they can clear absolutely anything in the game.

also exhausting your kit doesnt mean you actually needed it. i can use every single heal i have in a single mob pull and that doesnt prove the contrary.

[elioaiko]

Raising damage doesn't fix healers needing to "heal" more. At some point, constantly being brought down to 1HP constantly gets boring and a lazy attempt at solving the issue.

Receiving damage is too simple. You get hit with raidwides and your only option is heal through it faster than it can kill you or stagger the damage with mitigation. All healers have in this game is healing with some mitigation via shielding or percent-based.

Asking for them to make us take more damage is lame af. They can turn up the damage that you're wiping if you don't spam Medica perfectly. That's not fun.

Unfortunately they designed themselves into a corner and they're not changing it up. Time and time again they have proven to us that they have zero interest in revamping healers.

[Denji]

you could say the same thing about tanks. besides drks being a teeny bit squishier there really isn't a difference between any of them. i think people expect too much from an MMO tbh and i also think a lot of people don't realize that they're gotten, y'know, good. if something seems boring/easy after you've played it every day for 5-10 years it's possible that you've just outgrown the role/game.

it might always seem like you're doing terrible because you have some mix-maxing jerkass parser who never sleeps to always compare yourself to -- but the reality is that the average person who doesn't play daily typically does have trouble keeping up with later endgame content.

[Renalt]

if they add anymore oGCD heals...they may as well get rid of MP entirely. I hardly ever use and of my GCD heals. MP is practically a joke. I can rez like 6 people back to back and still have like half of my MP.

[currentlemon]

I do believe that healers have way too many healing options at the moment. Too much so that it's become bloated. I don't think nerfing the potency of the healing spells will be enough. Perhaps we should take into consideration of removing some healing spells. Perhaps we can start with Cure I/Physic/Benefic first? Maybe have some traits that upgrade them to their stronger spells at a later level (perhaps level 26). Would certainly help with button bloat.

Now, don't get me totally wrong. I am not entirely in opposition to adding some DPS skills. I think they are a fine way to reward the healer, and the party. Skills like Misery and Astrodyne are absolutely wonderful additions to the healer kits, and this definitely needs to be extended to the other healers, particularly SCH. But offensive GCD skills that are a normal part of the rotation will never come back. Like, ever.

I agree with this. Healers need to be rewarded for healing whether it be some fancy DPS or support spell. I put a lot of credit to Sarixis a lot, but there are ways we can incorporate offensive GCD spells that are tied to healing. For example, let's say we bring back Fluid Aura for WHM, rename it to Water and add a new trait that is correspondent to this new DPS spell and healing.

Water (formally Fluid Aura)

• Changed into a 2.5sec GCD ability
• Deals water damage with a potency of 100
• Additional Effect: Grants Cleric Stance
• Cleric Stance increases damage dealt by 5%
• Duration: 30secs
• Upgrades to Water II/Water III/Banish/ Banish III at later levels with higher dmg output.

Conviction

• When an ally's HP is below 50% and is healed by a GCD spell, the caster is granted three stacks of Conviction
• Conviction Effect: Increases the dmg potency of Water/Banish by 200
• Acquired at Level 50.

These suggested changes will do three things.

• It would somewhat alleviate the 1 button spam
• Encourge less overhealing
• Rewards the WHM for healing

[Semirhage]

I've said it probably a thousand times and I'll say it again.

Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare is as close to being objectively the most boring way you can design a job, and threads will take that statement and spiral off for twenty pages about "WELLLLLL, but you CAN'T have more than Glare Glare Glare because what if someone DIES to your GREED!? Then what happens? I don't know, you can't do more than that in your downtime it might be too SCARY! The devs aren't going to change this because they like it that way. Glare Glare Glare is good design! Omnomnom enjoy the pig slop, keep calling terrible design good!"

All of which is excuse-making for the most objectively garbage class design I've ever seen in an MMO.

[Raskbuck]

If they want to go the more nuclear option, just remove healers as a concept and rename the role to Support.

Give them a proper DPS rotation like some people are asking, and their utility would consist of enhancing the party with damage buffs. Incorporate Haste and Bravery as their core spell kit.

Eliminate the cooldown on Second Wind and attach an MP cost to it, similar to how Recuperate works. Give everyone Phoenix Down as a General action, with an associated cooldown and MP cost to simulate Swiftcast + Resurrect.

And you know what's funny about all this? The core encounter design wouldn't even change that much. Unless someone in the testing team is a little too good at using Second Wind. In that case they might have to remove them from the team.

This is just a poorly written piece born out of spite, from someone who enjoys healing and likes seeing those bars fill up. It's not meant to be taken too seriously.

[GeminiReed]

I'm one of the (very?) few on this forum against the idea of healer having a DPS rotation, and would only accept it if it's designed in a away that the DPS and healing channel do not interfere with each others for reason I had stated above. In my experience, if they are to be again given the choice between DPS or heal, the majority of healers I ran into can not be trust to make the responsible choice.

IMO I much prefer healer DPS and tank DPS to a lesser extent to only being required for the hardest content (Savage and Ultimate here). Encounters and healing should be engaging enough on their own merits and not require more DPS tools to be fun. Judging how the Role design team keeps taking away DPS toys from healers I wonder if they're of the same mind and are too polite to insist that healers heal.

Hint to the devs: If that's what you really want you need to stop coddling people who shouldn't be healing. Sure it should be accessible but you've simplified it so much that those motivated to play the role are so bored they're just not queuing. Instead of addressing the queue imbalance you've made it worse.

I like the whole "green DPS" meme as much as anyone else, but if I'm being serious for a moment, at that point I wonder why not just strip the role completely and just handle the healing responsibility to each person like in PvP.

Ugh, please no. GW2's little role-less experiment was wholly unappealing. My gripe has more to do with aggro management than healing but I find a solid trinity works best for the content that I like to do.