What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[Brinne]

Come now, it's a bit underhand to insinuate I'm getting defensive when you made such a sweeping blanket statement about anyone who criticises him, really.

Perhaps I should have said "some people" instead of "a lot of people?" I can agree with that, and I'll try to be more careful in the future.

[YukikoKurosawa]

I would argue that if FFXIV was a singleplayer title it would objectively have a better story.

[Theodric]

I wouldn't expect anyone to be familiar with every post that has been put forward though from what I've seen, a lot of the people criticising G'raha have spoken at length about not wanting Alisae to have a 'crush' upon their character as well. Furthermore, the Y'shtola baby talk scene was something discussed quite heavily within this very thread so...I strongly disagree with the idea that G'raha is being unfairly targeted. He just happens to be the most actively promoted lately.

[Midareyukki]

I would argue that if FFXIV was a singleplayer title it would objectively have a better story.

Don't play the 3rd Birthday. Or Lightning Returns. Or FF15 pre-retcons. Or post-retcons since now you need a book to finish the plot...

Point is, there really isn't any evidence it'd be any better. And Square does have some examples of single-player experiences which did not go down well.

[KizuyaKatogami]

I wouldn't expect anyone to be familiar with every post that has been put forward though from what I've seen, a lot of the people criticising G'raha have spoken at length about not wanting Alisae to have a 'crush' upon their character as well. Furthermore, the Y'shtola baby talk scene was something discussed quite heavily within this very thread so...I strongly disagree with the idea that G'raha is being unfairly targeted. He just happens to be the most actively promoted lately.

He’s also the biggest mary sue of them all recently that basically takes the spotlight and possible character depth away from other characters. Who needs flow when he can teleport everyone with 0 consequences. Who needs urianger as the bookworm when he just knows sooooo much.People dont seem to understand its not just his appearance, or personality or what have you. It's a combination of all of these factors. People just like to use blanket statements or write it off as you dont like him because of how he looks. I actually found graha somewhat cute as exarch. Now, hes hard for me to look at and it isnt his appearance doing that.

Don't play the 3rd Birthday.

We dont talk about this game. It is NOT a part of the PE series and i stand by that statement.

[Midareyukki]

He’s also the biggest mary sue of them all recently that basically takes the spotlight and possible character depth away from other characters. Who needs flow when he can teleport everyone with 0 consequences. Who needs urianger as the bookworm when he just knows sooooo much.

...Can we honestly give this G'raha circlejerk a rest? Because here's the thing. Remove G'raha, or better yet no, go back a few expansions, just before Shadowbringers.

Urianger is the bookworm, who could possibly outdo him?
Y'shtola sitting there cutely in the corner.

It's the Scions and they're Sharlayan. You WILL have bookworms.

G'raha has his flaws, we all know that, him having a bit more spotlight to get some more freshness and detail into him isn't bad, and the game isn't over yet so we most likely will have them.

So really, just give it a rest. As you were...

[KizuyaKatogami]

...Can we honestly give this G'raha circlejerk a rest? Because here's the thing. Remove G'raha, or better yet no, go back a few expansions, just before Shadowbringers.

Urianger is the bookworm, who could possibly outdo him?
Y'shtola sitting there cutely in the corner.

It's the Scions and they're Sharlayan. You WILL have bookworms.

G'raha has his flaws, we all know that, him having a bit more spotlight to get some more freshness and detail into him isn't bad, and the game isn't over yet so we most likely will have them.

So really, just give it a rest. As you were...

But when its separated amongst themselves thats good. It gives them all their own depth. Fast forward to EW where yshtola basically does nothing of substance because anything she can do(example, flow) Graha can do but better. Not sure why its so crazy to talk about one character but circlejerk hating on venat and hermes is fine?

[YukikoKurosawa]

I liked how when Graha was turning to crystal they played super sad music and made our character super sad even though the scene was literally telling you he's fine we have his soul and memories perserved, but they still tried to portray it like he was dying anyway.

Then the immediate scene after they just casually mention how he's fine.

[Lauront]

I wouldn't expect anyone to be familiar with every post that has been put forward though from what I've seen, a lot of the people criticising G'raha have spoken at length about not wanting Alisae to have a 'crush' upon their character as well. Furthermore, the Y'shtola baby talk scene was something discussed quite heavily within this very thread so...I strongly disagree with the idea that G'raha is being unfairly targeted. He just happens to be the most actively promoted lately.

Agreed, it's not unique to him. The slice of life stuff is an issue for some of us. Again, not a pivotal issue, but it doesn't do much for my enjoyment of the MSQ, and it is at the point where I wish I could bench some Scions and pick who is going along. Plus I'd like more dialogue options in response to them... much as I would've liked the same with Venat. It's a difference to me of her actions necessitating it and a "nice to have" for the Scions. In the case of Y'shtola I did not like what they did with her in 6.1 at all - she's not my favourite character by a longshot, but it undermined her character for me.

With that said, this thread circles back more on Venat or Hermes than any other characters for its grievances - justified, given their role in the plot, but G'raha does not receive anything like what those two do and when he comes up, it is for different reasons altogether.

Regarding Magnai being characterised as 'creepy' within his own culture, would someone jog my memory as to what's being referenced here? Genuine question as I've forgotten the ins and outs of that. That being said, the Steppes are not exactly the pinnacle of refined behaviour to begin with, and far worse goes on there than some advances he makes to women which he never forces himself upon. He is a tribal warlord at the end of the day and his demeanour and mentality fit with that to the degree the story allows it to. Y'shtola even remarked on his advances as better than most she's been on the receiving end of.

[tokinokanatae]

He is excitable but I feel like this part of his personality is being overused for cheap light-hearted moments, which for me reduces his integrity as a character but I think this problem of overusing specific tropes is more widespread than just G'raha. I am happy he gets to have his adventure alongside us, truly. I waited years hoping he would return. However, I can't help but be disappointed how they have handled his character thus far.

I think this is 100% fair and probably the biggest issue I have with him (and the Scions in general). I can love these characters, but only if they are individual characters with weight given to what their unique experiences bring to the table, not as a vaguely shaped blob of support and friendship.