Delete the Mentor system or rework it.

[Chekopacheko]

If the system were the problem it would not work anywhere, but it does in JPN servers. So probably, just probably, the problem is the NA community rather than the system itself

Also, if you find a toxic player (mentor or not) you can always submit a report, easier than asking for an entire system to be removed

[GeminiReed]

There are, of course, other problems with the system. Like the fact that the criteria for becoming a mentor have absolutely no bearing on how good anyone will be at it, for one.

This right here. The requirements are tuned to find people that know how to grind and are willing to put up with it. It does nothing to measure aptitude, willingness, nor ability to convey information in an understandable manner. The vast majority of questions that I've seen asked and answered were basic.

Mentors bringing up detailed meta-rotations tuned for Savage aren't helpful in the least to somebody that hasn't gotten their full kit yet. On NN I've seen just as much quality advice from other sprouts for the types of questions that a "Novice Network" should be structured to answer.

But the fact that people actually acting like mentors actively try to disassociate themselves from mentor program in many cases is just... It's a situation that kind of makes it blindingly obvious something has gone horribly wrong with the system somewhere along the line. (Possibly back in the original concept-and-design phase.)

A lot of this game's design seems to take a very optimistic (or naive) approach to human behavior. The commendation system is not a substitute for human evaluation and IMO the biggest problem with NN is that it's self-moderated. At a minimum both need trusted oversight.

[VerdeLuck]

If the system were the problem it would not work anywhere, but it does in JPN servers. So probably, just probably, the problem is the NA community rather than the system itself

Also, if you find a toxic player (mentor or not) you can always submit a report, easier than asking for an entire system to be removed

The problem with this is a toxic mentor stays a mentor even after multiple reports. Yeah they might get a talking to or a temporary ban but then they're right back in NN doing what they did before, just probably smarter to not get caught this time.

[D6Damager]

I have played on all NA data centers on various servers. While yes, the NN chat can devolve into attention seeking antics, I've never had someone not answer my questions promptly. I've never grouped with a mentor, but I haven't asked one to do that either.

My only observation is that there seems to always be max 100 mentors in the channel, however only a few are actually interacting in chat.

[Darthgummibear]

Sounds more like a you problem if "90% of mentors you meet are stuck up individuals that will strike out at you for no reason". I can count on one hand the unpleasant encounters I have had with mentors in recent years, all in all the system is mostly helpful for sprouts I'd say.

They aren't alone in this experience. Most mentors I've encountered either say nothing at all, or are narcissistic douchebags...to a much greater degree than any other game demographic.

[Chekopacheko]

The problem with this is a toxic mentor stays a mentor even after multiple reports. Yeah they might get a talking to or a temporary ban but then they're right back in NN doing what they did before, just probably smarter to not get caught this time.

That can be a nice suggestion to the dev team, to have the mentor status removed if the player has multiple reports, etc. It is something that actually makes sense

[Larirawiel]

That can be a nice suggestion to the dev team, to have the mentor status removed if the player has multiple reports, etc. It is something that actually makes sense

This functionality could be misused if it is possible to remove the mentor status from someone with some mass reports. Those fake mass reports could be easily coordinated by a FC or linkshell. The removal of the mentor crown should be done by a GM.




Cheers

[YukiB]

My only observation is that there seems to always be max 100 mentors in the channel, however only a few are actually interacting in chat.

If anything could be overhauled, it's the way the Novice Network works.

There's no reason for it to be exclusive to novices and mentors.

There's no reason novices should have to be invited.

There's no reason mentors and novices should be placed in it automatically if they're not interested in participating.

Make it opt-in on each login with a simple chat command like /novicenetwork join, and open it up to all players (with a sensible limit like 500-1000 if they're worried it'll become too noisy). And make clear mention of it in an early intro quest so new players actually know it exists.

[Chekopacheko]

This functionality could be misused if it is possible to remove the mentor status from someone with some mass reports. Those fake mass reports could be easily coordinated by a FC or linkshell. The removal of the mentor crown should be done by a GM.




Cheers

Oh yeah definitely, the removal should be done by a GM only. Sorry, I was not suggesting for this to be something that happens automatically just if you have several reports, but rather reports that have been previously checked by a GM to be true

[Scaramouche]

I have never made bad experiences with mentors. I have no clue why the people are so against the mentor system. :/




Cheers

I don't have either but I also only had 2 good experiences. The rest were just irrelevant and you could remove their crown you wouldn't see any difference.

If someone has 3 bad experiences 20 neutral and 2 good -3 +20x0 + 2 =-1 => overall bad experience. So even if you can say 22/25 experiences weren't bad you can also say 23/25 weren't good.

Now for the system itself

On paper its great. You have experienced players helping new players or returnees and they get reward for it.
You even have nice criteria to be sure everything won't go wrong.

3 roles at max level, proof of role knowledge.

1000 dungeons, proof of pve/mechanic knowledge.

1500 commendations, proof of commendable behavior

the first two criteria mean "I can help you" and the last "I will help you"

But in practice having a level 90 tank/dps/healer doesn't mean you know how to play them. You can spam ifrit 1000 times to meet the 1000 dungeons criteria and people hand over commendations not because the people were helpful and nice but because they were tank/healer or had a funny name/cute glamour.

So when most are commended base on how they look or what they play and not because they left a good impression (which is the achievement name more or less) thanks to their behavior, they probably won't left a good impression when they become mentor.


That's one problem with mentor system but the biggest issue is mentor roulette and the rewards especially the mount which leads to 2 major issues.

1) People like mounts so to get it they have to be mentor regardless if they want it or not and when they don't it leads to hostile behavior.

2) Roulette require you to complete most dungeon but you can just unsync most of them so whenever a mentor get a dungeon he did 6 months ago unsync he might failed a mechanic he didn't know and keep the mentor = bad stereotype.


And with all the guides for dungeons or jobs available all over Internet you don't really need mentors to begin with.
h

So you have a system plagued by bad players whether its game knowledge issue, behavior or both and the good one aren't going to be better than a guide on YT. The only exception where a good mentor is better than a guide is whenever someone hasn't done a dungeon for a long time and forgot the mechanic.