What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[SeverianLyonesse]

Opinion poll time! :P Are you more confident, less confident, unchanged, or undecided about Ishikawa possibly (I'm not sure it's been confirmed) having done the outline for the next 10 years?

I'd have to say undecided. I wish they'd talked about Venat. Ishikawa admitting despite Hermes being her favorite character she thought 80% of players would hate him indicates she has her finger on the pulse more than Yoshi-P does, but without knowing the same about Venat it's hard to say.

I'm significantly less confident regarding Yoshi-P. I don't know how much influence he has in the story, but I'm as baffled by his responses to things as he is to ours.

I think she has poor taste if Hermes is her favorite character. Between Hermes' poorly developed metanoia at the end of Elpis, the utterly contrived "test of humanity" and time-reversal plot devices, the vague hand-waving of the continuity of his soul post-sundering, the overall lazy and unnecessary retconning of Amon into his backstory, and the general insufferability of Fandaniel--imo a poor example of how to write a flippant character, as far as mannerisms, dialogue, and plotting are concerned--I think he is possibly the worst character in the series. I understand what Hermes/Fandaniel was supposed to function as in the story--I think it was horribly handled.

I think she's overrated. As much as I enjoyed ShB as a self-contained side story, I think it stands out as the least necessary expansion to the Hydaelyn arc. And Endwalker felt too splayed and rushed conceptually, and in several ways just a retrod of ShB ideas. So I don't have much faith in her ability to plot a whole multi-expansion arc. I wish I could say otherwise because she seems like a very nice person and despite being largely superfluous ShB had some outstanding ideas. But if Hermes is her barometer of her writing style, I think it quite likely that I will not like the ideas she puts forth in the future.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I think people got too enamoured by the edgy, emotional stories such as DK questline and Shadowbringers that honestly dampens too much the mood with the story sometimes. Im happy we got our lighter moments in EW and in general still enjoyed the expansion experience but yeah I miss the tone style of ARR and I hope 7.0 leans into it with more emphasis on adventure and less melodrama

[kpxmanifesto]

I think people got too enamoured by the edgy, emotional stories such as DK questline and Shadowbringers that honestly dampens too much the mood with the story sometimes. Im happy we got our lighter moments in EW and in general still enjoyed the expansion experience but yeah I miss the tone style of ARR and I hope 7.0 leans into it with more emphasis on adventure and less melodrama

I honestly thought EW tried to be the most melodramatic of all the xpacs to the point that it became overdone and stale. Every time an "emotional" scene came around I was like: "Ok, here we go again." I'd also much prefer if it went back to a light-hearted setting in 7.0.

[Ixon]

I honestly thought EW tried to be the most melodramatic of all the xpacs to the point that it became overdone and stale. Every time an "emotional" scene came around I was like: "Ok, here we go again." I'd also much prefer if it went back to a light-hearted setting in 7.0.

I see no reason for this to happen(hopefully), due to the fact that we have zero pressing matters at hand other than trying to make Garlemald an ally of the world and doing a Fordola and Giaus style arc of "be nice to the previous enemy that killed your loved ones". I feel the patches leading up to next expansion are to cover that, with something happening near the end that will have us plan to go to either the New World or most likely Mericydia and deal with some sort of conlfict on a much smaller scale over there.

[Skyborne]

I think she has poor taste if Hermes is her favorite character. Between Hermes' poorly developed metanoia at the end of Elpis, the utterly contrived "test of humanity" and time-reversal plot devices, the vague hand-waving of the continuity of his soul post-sundering, the overall lazy and unnecessary retconning of Amon into his backstory, and the general insufferability of Fandaniel--imo a poor example of how to write a flippant character, as far as mannerisms, dialogue, and plotting are concerned--I think he is possibly the worst character in the series. I understand what Hermes/Fandaniel was supposed to function as in the story--I think it was horribly handled.

I think she's overrated. As much as I enjoyed ShB as a self-contained side story, I think it stands out as the least necessary expansion to the Hydaelyn arc. And Endwalker felt too splayed and rushed conceptually, and in several ways just a retrod of ShB ideas. So I don't have much faith in her ability to plot a whole multi-expansion arc. I wish I could say otherwise because she seems like a very nice person and despite being largely superfluous ShB had some outstanding ideas. But if Hermes is her barometer of her writing style, I think it quite likely that I will not like the ideas she puts forth in the future.

This.
Guys... dying is sad, and I think we could treat these animals summoned from our own aether better. You want to judge them? Well, what if... they judged US? Huh? Huh? This says a lot about society. Are we... the baddies? Really makes you think about the meaning of life... oh, and FF3 funny clown theatre man because it's Yoshida's fave.

I do think planning out everything from the start, at least in a basic skeletal form, would benefit the next story though. It seemed obvious they were improvising things as they went along to an extent, though I've seen many who think that the writing team all planned everything out meticulously for the entire 10 years as if a writer looking at old things and going "Hmm, this will be useful" is something new. And as much as I liked parts of Shadowbringers for actually showing the antagonist's pov in a slightly more fair way than what we got in EW, it was also ground zero for all the "forge ahead!" "stand tall!" "better brighter tomorrow!" "hope hope hope!" nauseating and cloying preaching.

On top of that, it doesn't make me look forward to FF16 or its story much...

I
I’ve liked Ishikawas work since Ysayle and Moenbryda so she’s got my support. Endwalker has only made me more a fan.

She wrote Ysayle? Never knew that. I liked her since she was flawed and more gritty and had an actual spine. Her "delusion" of being Shiva reborn was shattered, but her sincerity and conviction wound up winning over Hraesvelgr. The game also never gave me the impression of forcing me to love her. Horsefarts seemed to get most of the acclaim, though.

[SeverianLyonesse]

She wrote Ysayle? Never knew that. I liked her since she was flawed and more gritty and had an actual spine. Her "delusion" of being Shiva reborn was shattered, but her sincerity and conviction wound up winning over Hraesvelgr. The game also never gave me the impression of forcing me to love her. Horsefarts seemed to get most of the acclaim, though.

And she did also write Ardbert. So it's not like she hasn't written good characters in the past.

I just wonder what the hell went wrong with Hermes/Fandaniel. Hermes starts out okay and then takes several hard left turns into nonsense territory.

[Skyborne]

And she did also write Ardbert. So it's not like she hasn't written good characters in the past.

I just wonder what the hell went wrong with Hermes/Fandaniel. Hermes starts out okay and then takes several hard left turns into nonsense territory.

No way I could forget him either... the Sad Ardbert sessions were one of my favorite parts. He should really knock on the door before showing up, though. Rip WoL's privacy. Hermes made sense to me but I'm just not that big of a fan of the archetype or motivation, Yoshida claiming it was impartial even though Hermes was clearly having an emotional crisis before and during was odd, though.

only to have Zenos crash through the cieling(which to this day I still love).

If only he had showed up sooner and interrupted the endless Alphirants/Scion speeches, Jack Garland style. Also, IIRC, I can't find the source but I'm sure Lauront could, but they did originally plan it to be more dismal but irl events influenced them to make it 'brighter'. And honestly, Amaurot/Elpis was the best "escapism" and a nice slice of paradise away from the increasing gloom of irl for me (and from characters I largely did not care for), until crystal mom told me that escapism was bad and dragged me out Marche-style. Thanks...

[Ixon]

As much as I like a realistic story, I also don't need it to be real, after all, a lot of people play games to escape reality. I don't need it all to make sense in the end, I just need it to be fun. A sad scientist making a robot that decides the best thing for humanity is for all of use to die isn't that far fetched, and honestly a very common trope. As flawed as Venat was at times, at least it did breath more life into Hydaelyn, a character that I gave no care to at all till EW if I am completely honest. The Venat to Hydaelyn arc was at least more interesting than some benevolent all good light god that whispered at us now and then, though of course it could have been fleshed out a bit better. The only thing that I felt was SUPER forced was Fandaniel also being Amon. I feel ShB made you side with Emet TOO much as it caused many to forget he was a mass murdering psychopath, self included. And I would not have been surprised if there was a push for "hope in times of despair" more so in this expansion due to them working on this mid-pandemic, which I can't blame them for.

For me, regardless of it's plot holes I still had fun, and I enjoyed the surprises without them feeling forced. Zodiark as the lvl 83 trial, traveling back in time to Elps, seeing the faces and talking to people we really only knew as shades or hooded figures for a long time, discovering the reasoning for the final days, the self sacrifice of yourself to teleport your friends away only to have Zenos crash through the cieling(which to this day I still love), followed by an epic anime style Metion fight, ending with fisticuffs with Zenos. I enjoyed it all. Sure I could feel the pacing being a bit off here and there, and I wished this was two expansions instead of one, but I am not too worried about future expansions cause I had more fun and memorable moments in EW than I had in any previous expansion. I could be huffing the copium, and we will have to wait and see, but I am excited for a clean slate and a new story.