Is it just me or are some Healers refusing to Heal Paladins?

[HisShadowX]

This thread really reminds me that SE really needs to add more healer trusts in the game.

I would rather see programmable Gambits in Trusts like we had in FF12 and that games like Dragon Age 1 used.

For example I would set my healer to heal after you go below 50%

[ZephyrMenodora]

To play devil's advocate, the DPS being off in Narnia could also be classed as 'Uncooperative behaviour' as you are actively making the job of the healer harder. This swings both ways and is a reason why, in these situations, you cannot just slam down the ToS and not consider the opposing view.

The crux of the matter is, if noone dies, why does it matter whether a healer keeps you fully topped up or not? As a long time tank player, I have come across several types of healers and the only ones I feared for my life are the ones that tunnel vision DPS and do not consider healing at all. I never consider using Clemency unless the healer is dead and even then, if I think I can get through without using it, I will.

In regards to big dungeon pulls, I would honestly say the biggest factor is the DPS. If the DPS is not high enough, it doesn't matter how good your tank/healer are, you will make it harder for them and be more of a nuisance than anything else.

We were responding to a healer who literally posted that they do let people die and don't care, thinking it will teach them a lesson.

[TaleraRistain]

There is a fundamental difference in our mindset. You show up to content to keep healthbars full. I show up to heal as efficiently as possible and will not adjust for bad play. Simple.

It's not healing efficiently if your party can't do their job because you're obsessed with this or that number. The optimization mindset is fine in content that requires it and with players where you're familiar with their style. But in a dungeon situation with random players, it's the person not helping them do their jobs that is playing badly.

[IDontPetLalas]

It's not healing efficiently if your party can't do their job because you're obsessed with this or that number. The optimization mindset is fine in content that requires it and with players where you're familiar with their style. But in a dungeon situation with random players, it's the person not helping them do their jobs that is playing badly.

Or it can be argued that it's the players who are:

- consistently staying out of range of healing range
- repeatedly/deliberately not avoiding avoidable damage
- not attempting to follow mechanics, taking advice , e.g. follow the dorito, look at party chat
- not using CDs, self-heals

Are not helping the healer, and are being uncooperative. I mean we can beat this to death, however it goes to a certain knowledge of each job, a certain reasonable level of performance that should be expected of each job, i would say by all means leave sprouts out of the above- but that's not even being optimal.

[Mikey_R]

We were responding to a healer who literally posted that they do let people die and don't care, thinking it will teach them a lesson.

I never justified their actions, I just stated the ToS that was posted could be taken in both ways and is therefore not a good argument for or against the actions of the healer/dps in that scenario.

[ZephyrMenodora]

Or it can be argued that it's the players who are:

- consistently staying out of range of healing range
- repeatedly/deliberately not avoiding avoidable damage
- not attempting to follow mechanics, taking advice , e.g. follow the dorito, look at party chat
- not using CDs, self-heals

Are not helping the healer, and are being uncooperative. I mean we can beat this to death, however it goes to a certain knowledge of each job, a certain reasonable level of performance that should be expected of each job, i would say by all means leave sprouts out of the above- but that's not even being optimal.

I think everyone should agree that "deliberately" not avoiding avoidable damage is disrespectful to the entire party. The healer has to cater to you and could be doing other things like more damage instead.

I disagree about "repeatedly" as there are so many encounters in this game but it can be hard to remember everything, and some of them are a little confusing so it's possible a player gets hit by things more than once. I had an Omega raid for example where I was doing it for the first time so I had just watched a video, but we wiped the first time as the group literally hadn't been there in years so I was able to type in chat where they needed to stand for the AEs, as they were essentially a set pattern the first half of the fight. So, I don't find it being purposely uncooperative to just forget, or be less skilled at a given mechanic.

I usually see this in alliance raids a lot, but for whatever reason people spread out all over the encounter. I try to stand in the middle but there are those ranged DPS that ends up out of range. Just ask them to stay closer to you. If they don't because they aren't paying attention, I'll still move to try to find them if I can so they don't die. Doesn't always work and I could use that time again to do something else, but overall it's best they remain alive. Unless they are running away from me on purpose, which has never happened in my history of playing this game, I don't find that to be purposely uncooperative.

I do find a healer acting like a prima-donna and refusing to heal someone when they can because they think they aren't a good enough player, and also just pretending their GCD heals don't even exist at all, is uncooperative.

People like this should only play in statics or party-finders. Else you must adapt to the random players you get in duty finder.

99% of the time, players in duty finder are not playing sub-optimally out of malice.

[AnnRam]

Who cares as long the Healer its busy doing DPS(faster run/clear) and healing when needed it instead of bein a bot spamming heals for no reason.

Some people are just horrible at being healers, like when someone got resurrect and a big aoe comes next they forget to heal him/her and dies because they are still at 20% hp.

[Pyro2hell3]

Who cares as long the Healer its busy doing DPS(faster run/clear) and healing when needed it instead of bein a bot spamming heals for no reason.

Some people are just horrible at being healers, like when someone got resurrect and a big aoe comes next they forget to heal him/her and dies because they are still at 20% hp.

or the healer dies right before the aoe goes off and whoever the poor sob that's getting killed will be blamed for it and before you mention the the thing makes you take no damage for a bit after being res'd that only helps if the aoe happens before it wears off

[DanielNegreanu_Adamantoise]

Nah. Curebots get showered in comms and healers who actually know what they are doing don't get much because tanks and DPS who don't know how healing works don't see them casting benefic. It's worse in 8 man stuff because other players assume the """glarebot""" is chadding and are unloading all the healing onto the curebot when the other healer with 80% overhealing just leaves them nothing to heal in the first place.

Yeah I know comms not really the best thing but maybe some kind of rude/downer/rager commendation that you can give out to those special someones
Its not to discourage good play its to encourage impatient tryhards from ruining other people's fun by complaining that a rando-duty finder doesn't measure up to their static's standards

[TaleraRistain]

Or it can be argued that it's the players who are:

- consistently staying out of range of healing range
- repeatedly/deliberately not avoiding avoidable damage
- not attempting to follow mechanics, taking advice , e.g. follow the dorito, look at party chat
- not using CDs, self-heals

Are not helping the healer, and are being uncooperative. I mean we can beat this to death, however it goes to a certain knowledge of each job, a certain reasonable level of performance that should be expected of each job, i would say by all means leave sprouts out of the above- but that's not even being optimal.

Only if you think the people are doing that (or have communicated they are as I mentioned about the "healer adjust" attitude) entirely on purpose and are deliberately setting out to screw up and mess up your day. All of those could be someone is new, someone is inexperienced, someone has a mechanic they just don't get, someone is tired, someone got momentarily distracted, someone is just off that day, or any other thing that could be happening behind the screen. I see this mindset a lot, that random players are messing up on purpose just to ruin someone else's run. And it's just not true. The vast majority of players are just trying to get through the run for whatever reason they need to run it. Trying to label them with things like uncooperative and playing badly is just trying to justify punitive behavior.