Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

[Atelier-Bagur]

old healer kit in ARR content. im not exaggerating when i say any healer had more stuff to do during downtime (and also less downtime) in sastasha during heavensward.

im not saying we should go back, but surely if those lv 16 newbies could handle aero, stone, fluid aura, maybe a cross classed thunder.... why did aero iii suddenly become too much to handle in shadowbringers? a fresh lv 30 scholar could handle energy drain, bio, bio ii, miasma... but suddenly in shadowbringers lv 80 healers will have panic attacks if they have more than just bio and broil? yeah right

I wish we still had cross class skills, then that would probably fix all the "boring" combat and class design issues people have now with the game.

[Jeeqbit]

Sage is really the same as scholar. The only difference is that instead of pressing your damage over time attack, you have to unlock it with Eukrasia. This does feel really good but it's not a big difference.

Maybe Criterion dungeons will offer something.

[technole]

TEA is pretty rough on healers during LL. That was tuned extremely well, but it does easier in that department once you get past BJ/CC, it's savage level at best from that point on. I figure he might have been referring to that.

I'd also argue healing can be testy on week 1 savage in the last two floors when you are barely geared, but as soon as you get a few upgrades things change dramatically. Sometimes I feel their balancing team seems to blow the lids off once you gain +10 ilvl.

[AziraSyuren]

I wish we still had cross class skills, then that would probably fix all the "boring" combat and class design issues people have now with the game.

Cross-class skills didn't even do anything good in the glory days of HW. They were just there.

You could go on and on about "fake choice" and "balance issues," but the truth is that they were an inconsequential extra button press even at their best.

And they would be now were they re-added.

[Thoosa]

Sadly I think the answer is M+ if you want a challenging healing experience, where there’s constant damage to heal and you have more than one dps button. The fact that this game is largely built around scripted incoming damage makes changes difficult in terms of making healing busier. I don’t know if there’s any reason why they don’t give healers more damage buttons though?

[Atelier-Bagur]

Cross-class skills didn't even do anything good in the glory days of HW. They were just there.

You could go on and on about "fake choice" and "balance issues," but the truth is that they were an inconsequential extra button press even at their best.

And they would be now were they re-added.

So what, you WOULDNT want some black mage or Summoner spells to fit into your dps toolkit as a healer. My fault for not specifying, I meant the "spirit" of cross-class skills not the limited version they once had. If this class system played a bit like FFV where you have a primary job with a secondary job that would be the best thing ever in an MMO.

[Vortuna]

Perhaps I'm one of the very few who chose to play healer in savage and ultimates because we have only two dps buttons to worry about due to tunnel visioning issues.

I play all roles but generally couldn't do anything past extremes without dropping rotations due to focusing on mechanics, or dying to mechanics due to focusing on rotations at the wrong time.

[Lauront]

No one is asking for Elden Ring difficulty around here. We're just fed up with having so little in the way of "fun" buttons.

You will note that whenever people ask for more difficult content it always jumps to extremes like Dark Souls games etc. Same with how asking for more non-throwaway character deaths in the story is equated with wanting GoT levels of it.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Tank Gameplay is really boring too. Like it’s not just a healer thing.Does anyone actually like spamming 2 aoe skills in dungeons?

I think people come to this game hoping for good gameplay but really I wouldn’t recommend gameplay to my IRL friends as a selling point of this game. The story experience is streamline and easy for single player. It doesn’t seem like they will change the way this game is DPS oriented now that it’s been out almost 10 years.

Side note as a healer main , I don’t know why healers ask for more dps skills. You don’t want to have more crud to press in savage raids plus healing your team and running around too.

yeah you have your basic AoEs and your ogcds mixed in along with damage mitigation. Its not boring, whatsoever. I counter your statement that I was able to get friends who wouldnt play MMOs to try FFXIV due to how easy it is and they wound up enjoying it. So yeah that opinion of yours goes both ways, fight me.

[Azurarok]

Going by what YoshiP's said last night and in Media Tour interviews, the crux of the issue seems to be in the devs feeling pressured they have to have every member in the party to be fully utilizing their kits in order for them to clear their hardest content.
If they add a robust dps kit to Healers, they believe they have to design Ultimates with Healers taking full advantage of it in mind and think that adds too much weight on them for the clear.

Except, if that's the case I think it's fine for them to design them without the extra dps that'd bring? Would it be unacceptable to design them around only being able to do as much as the current single button dps-ing can, as long as they make the healing difficult enough to make it hard enough to even get around to it?

Healers only really get the chance to dps regularly in duties if the party's doing everything well. That requires everyone to know the fight, which in most cases mean the party's farming or running roulettes, and I think it's perfectly fine to be given that extra dps at that point.