Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

[Caurcas]

SE gutting gameplay and refusing add anything mildly engaging back? Never!

[LittleImp]

Maybe you'll be able to buy new healer DPS skills in NFT form.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

you should take it as a compliment, but you prefer to see maliciousness.

Holy shit, the quote in your post is beautiful. Modern gamers and game devs take note.

All this said, I mean after reading the entire thread, I can see Yoshi P's statement made a lot of people mad. But he isn't wrong. If you feel unchallenged, on ANY role, go to do more challenging content. It's that simple.

[KizuyaKatogami]

Holy shit, the quote in your post is beautiful. Modern gamers and game devs take note.

All this said, I mean after reading the entire thread, I can see Yoshi P's statement made a lot of people mad. But he isn't wrong. If you feel unchallenged, on ANY role, go to do more challenging content. It's that simple.

It’s the fact about engagement. Healers don’t feel engaging in any content, his solution is to do Ultimate then. He’s basically admitting that all the other forms of content aren’t engaging for healers, instead of addressing the problem itself, he’s scapegoating, as he always does.

[SamsaraTrickstar]

This is effectively what the lead designer of this game told Healers in the latest live letter.

Consider if he had said that about your role for a second and how you would feel.

Forget the leveling experience, it doesn't matter.

Forget dungeons up to 90, they don't matter.

Forget normal raids, EX's, and Savage, they don't matter.

If you want your job to be engaging, play Ultimate, the hardest content in the game that only a few percentage of actual players do.

ye its a really bad take by him. but then take a look at the part where he want the game to be more and more and more like a SOLO RPG. so if you go heal bots it be a bit more hard for you

[Xaruko_Nexume]

Also, I feel like a lot of posters in this thread likely play mostly with statics or friends and as a result, are out of touch with the general player base. Not the devs. The OP has a forum signature that pretty much says this, which is ironic. Just being on these forums almost automatically puts you at a higher level than most players who rarely know they even exist.

Almost every day in my daily roulettes, I STILL encounter healers who dont even want to DPS as things are RIGHT NOW...and this thread clamors for MORE challenge...

so Yoshi P has the data and has the right path going forward here, I believe.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Learned how to not overheal? Congratulations! That's great of you to improve! Now then...

How would you feel the first time you find out that as a HEALER whose job is supposed to heal actually spend more than half of the time in their general contents casting damaging spells instead of healing? I am not even exaggerating there. "Half of the time" is very lenient because at that point said healers must've been overhealing by large amount or largely doing nothing aside twitching their thumbs until damage happens to heal. Personally? I immediately embrace the "Green DPS meme" identity, because that's what the numbers really tells us. They never lie.

Im sorry but Im not in that same mindset as you. When I play a healer in this game, I go into the mindset that my goal is to keep the party alive, not to just be an extra DPS. Yes I contribute to dealing damage when allowed but most of my time is spent on patching up the MT during mob pulls or mitigating damage during raids and bosses. Thats all I expect for a "healer" to do.

Again I feel like we've grown too jaded and complacent over the green dps meme and that healing is nothing but a 3rd dps job when that wasnt its intention at all. You grow to not like healing anymore then OK FINE! go play another job, healing is just not for you. Healers arent designed to have to juggle between dps rotations and keeping healing on top. The whole point of the holy trinity is to cater to those 3 core play styles. Tanks are for people who want to lead and be up front, dps are there for those who want to focus on dealing damage and healers are for those who care more about supporting.

[Equitable_Remedy]

This is effectively what the lead designer of this game told Healers in the latest live letter.

Consider if he had said that about your role for a second and how you would feel.

Forget the leveling experience, it doesn't matter.

Forget dungeons up to 90, they don't matter.

Forget normal raids, EX's, and Savage, they don't matter.

If you want your job to be engaging, play Ultimate, the hardest content in the game that only a few percentage of actual players do.

I know that the internet is supposed to be an endless outrage machine, but c'mon...

[AnotherPerson]

Speak for ya'll selves, I still get nervous having to heal in content, just because of the nature of healing alone. I think the issue they see if healers get more damage spells for rotations then healers in this game would start to focus more on DPS'ing rather than healing which just....negates the purpose of having a healer in the holy trinity the system was made for. I think we've grown too complacent with the idea that "healers are a dps" job when its in their job description to heal not to deal damage.

This is an extremely BASED opinion on my part though because I'm a controller user andy and having to add more buttons for full on damage rotations alongside your meaty healer toolkit will just overload the cross-bar hotbar setup into a complicated mess.

What holy trinity? Tanks can heal themselves AND the party now. DPS have healing tools built into their toolkit to contribute to healing. Some jobs that aren't healers even got more tools to help with mitigation this expansion. What about healers? Got some additional skills in the DPS rotation while everyone gets some healing or mitigation tools? Nope. None of that.

I want to see exactly - how many more people will enjoy tanking if they removed the 1-2-3 rotation, replaced it to 1 single target attack, 1 AoE, and 1 long range attack and give tanks only more mitigation skills like rampart every expansion. No Crit Fell Cleave, No Primal Rend, No Confiteor, No Blade of Faith, No Blade of Truth, No Blade of Valor, No Bloodspiller, No Flood of Shadow, No Shadowbringer, No Double Down, No Hypervelocity, No Continuation, No Gnashing Fang Combo.

GNB will now do Keen Edge on every attack from Lv 1 onwards, have it upgraded to Brutal Shell at lv 54, Solid Barrel at lv 64, Burst Strike at Lv 72, and Hypervelocity at Lv 82. They get Demon Slice at lv 10, and it upgrades into Demon Slaughter at lv 82. As a "DPS" tank like "DPS" healer Sage, you can also press Sonic Break OR Bow Shock at lv 62. You also get 2 charges of Camouflage, 2 charges of Nebula, and 2 charges of Heart of Stone/Heart of Corundum though to help mitigate damage!

DRK will now do Hard Slash on every attack from Lv 1 onwards, have it upgraded to Siphon Strike at lv 54, Soul Eater at lv 64, Carve and Spit at Lv 72, Bloodspiller at 82. Oh, for AoE, your Unleash is learned at Lv 10. It auto upgrades to Stalwart Soul at lv 82 rather than 72. You get 2 charges of Shadow Wall, 2 charges of Dark Mind, 2 charges of Abyssal Drain, 2 charges of Dark Missionary (that also shields the party with a potency of 500), 3 charges of Oblation. To facilitate the ease of tanking, you no longer have to worry about MP on Flood of Shadow and Edge of Shadow, because they'll be removed. Instead, you'll get Salted Earth at 62 and Salt and Darkness at 90!

PLD will now do Fast Blade on every attack from Lv 1 onwards, have it upgraded to Riot Blade at lv 18, Rage of Halone at lv 30, Spirits Within at 54, Goring Blade at 64, Royal Authority at 72, Atonement at 82. Your single target attack will always generate MP. For AoE, they get prominence at Lv 10, and it upgrades to Eclipse at 82. You get Sentinel, Divine Veil, and Intervention on a lower cooldown with 2 charges. Holy Sheltron still exists, but instead of generating 5 gauge on every auto attack, you naturally generate 50 gauge every 25 seconds in combat. Oh, and Holy Circle is learned at 62, but now on a 2 charge system at lv 90. This way, it doesn't affect your MP to spend solely on Clemency, which will now be an ability and instant cast.

WAR will now do heavy swing at Lv 1 onwards, have it upgraded to Maim at lv 18, Storm's Path at Lv 30, Storm's Eye at 54, Inner Beast at 64, Fell Cleave at 72, Inner Chaos at 82. For AoE, Overpower is learned at Lv 10 and it auto upgrades to Steel Cyclone at 82. Inner Release is a nice tank ability, except now you don't crit or direct hit because those don't do anything to tanking. Instead, you mitigate an additional 20% with all your already strong mitigations! Don't worry though, because at 80, you'll unlock Upheaval whenever you use Inner Release, or use Oregeny at 90!

You feel that your damage (rotation) is lacking? No, that must mean you think your AGGRO will be affected! No worries, now your NATURAL AGGRO GENERATION will be 20x instead of 10x! No fear of losing aggro. Isn't that great as a TANK? Now you can actually take ALL your time to make sure you PROPERLY POSITION The enemies in case it's too DIFFICULT to spare EXTRA energy on it! EVEN WHEN YOU DON'T NEED TO. SO YOU CAN IMMEDIATELY DO IT AT A MOMENT'S NOTICE.

That's basically healers, except you replace "AGGRO" with "HEALING", "NATURAL AGGRO GENERATION" with "TOTAL HEALING POWER", and "PROPERLY POSITION" with "PROPERLY STARE AT THE HP BARS".
If that sounds jaded, that's because healers basically dealt with this for multiple years. If the focus for healers was the same as tanks, it wouldn't be so bad. However, they basically implied that there are only 2 healers: beginner healers and ultimate-level healer raiders. No in-between. No 'average level healer that isn't amazing, but at least understands the core functions of their toolkit and have been DPSing often because tanks can keep their HP afloat with only a couple of additional heals on their part'. THAT's the big problem with the current healer design. The best of healers can DPS with 90%+ downtime. The worst of healers cannot because they use Cure I / Diagnosis / Physick / Benefic and it eats away at their MP. Where is the huge disparity gap from 0% to 90%? What about a decent player with 60% downtime? Just spam their single offensive button for over half the fight?

[GrimGale]

Im sorry but Im not in that same mindset as you. When I play a healer in this game, I go into the mindset that my goal is to keep the party alive, not to just be an extra DPS. Yes I contribute to dealing damage when allowed but most of my time is spent on patching up the MT during mob pulls or mitigating damage during raids and bosses. Thats all I expect for a "healer" to do.

Again I feel like we've grown too jaded and complacent over the green dps meme and that healing is nothing but a 3rd dps job when that wasnt its intention at all. You grow to not like healing anymore then OK FINE! go play another job, healing is just not for you. Healers arent designed to have to juggle between dps rotations and keeping healing on top. The whole point of the holy trinity is to cater to those 3 core play styles. Tanks are for people who want to lead and be up front, dps are there for those who want to focus on dealing damage and healers are for those who care more about supporting.

That be a reasonable answer if healing requirements were significant.

Yes, some players mess up and you're there to pick them up, janitor style, from the floor.
You can heal booboos most of the time, but if they get hit in the first place its already their fault. You pick up their mistakes so it mostly depends on who you're playing with. No mistakes? No healinh role for you back to spamming your 1 button rotation. Plenty of mistakes? No amount of healing will save them, worse off they might just wipe the group.

Healing has very little actual value, and GCD healing even less value.

That should tell you what is wrong with the role.