"You pull, you tank" is a bad mentality

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Well, this is good reading material.

You love it
I do too.

[Ivtrix]

This is why I only either queue with friends or as tank when I do dungeons. As a warrior I literally don’t need the other 3 players for any content past 56 but it def speeds things up.

But I generally avoid dungeons in general and just hunt A/S ranks for tomestones.

The best way to avoid people you don’t like to play with is to simply never interact with them.

[LeonKeyh]

Well, this is good reading material.

OP was like:

https://i.imgur.com/O8TQ44g.gif

[Bacent]

Don't pull. Issue done. /end

[Skiros]

skiros is this the only way you can get people to talk to you

I like talking to random people on the Internet. My IRL friends can be a bit unexciting... They're wonderful people, but sometimes I need that spice. This forum has that spice. It's exciting!

Don't worry I'll probably be bored soon enough.

[Ivtrix]

Lol, I frankly did not expect this. I was just blurting out my unfiltered thoughts since I saw that one tank meme on a subreddit and I found it funny. I expected some cries of me trolling and a few people disagreeing. But I did not expect people to say things like "I'm a tank, I'm a leader" or for this to reach 20 pages. That "tanking is being a leader" shit was funny and made my day.

The response to this on Twitter was phenomenal. Herbal essences!

[TMW001]

It is all down to lack of communication isn’t it.

It is the job for the tank to tank and the tank know how many he/she can handle.

If anyone feel the pull is too small, the first thing should ask the tank and heal if they can do a bigger pull.

There are no norm, it is a party decision.

When ever I tank I always and always make sure with the healer if they prefer I go big or take chunks never know if someone is new to a raid and are unsure of mechanics not everyone will be on the same page.

[Saraide]

IM the warrior of light, not you ffs what do you dpses and healers not understand about this??

No, I'm Spartacus.

[TaleraRistain]

No I didn't? I said the Sage in your example essentially has a win/win scenario. If they can't handle the pull size when a DPS dragsin extra, they can blame them since they asked beforehand. If they can handle it, then they've just learned they're more capable than they thought.

You said you didn't understand the logic and are pretty much okaying the dps just pulling anyway even if the healer says something in chat. In your view, they can just be safely ignored because they might learn from it.

But in the tank example, you say the onus is on the tank to say something if they want something different. Implying that you think they shouldn't be ignored.

Why would one role be ignored and the other not? Either both can communicate in chat if they want something different and be respected or neither can.

This kind of telling tanks where they can and can't be new isn't a new thing for you, either. I remember when I was talking about learning tanking basics cause I had leveled for amaro but wanted to get things down. I said I was sticking to baby dungeons so I didn't inflict my inexperience on others. You told me that was just unacceptable because those poor vets in those dungeons just wanted to get their roulettes done.

So that's tanks can be inexperienced in baby dungeons, tanks can't be inexperienced in 71+ content, tanks can't learn big pulls in a live experience in higher level dungeons and should just stick to Trusts for that when Trusts often let you die doing that, tanks can't withhold tanking because the impatient dps can't keep it in their pants a second, 50 dungeons are okay to new tank in because that's where *you* learned, and healers can't ask for smaller pulls because Twelve forbid they want to learn healing at their pace.

Honestly, Forte, in this and other threads I've just gotten the impression you don't think people should be allowed to be new or inexperienced or uncertain if it's ever going to cause a run to go slower than what you personally expect. But that's going to happen because we have a wide range of experience and ability levels and we all get mixed up together when we get randomly matched. The best we can do is be considerate of each other and set our egos and expectations aside for a just a little bit so we can finish a run with people we'll probably never see again.

[ForteNightshade]

You said you didn't understand the logic and are pretty much okaying the dps just pulling anyway even if the healer says something in chat. In your view, they can just be safely ignored because they might learn from it.

This is you inferring something I'm neither saying nor implying. What I said is simply why fuss over a DPS pulling ahead in the specific scenario you outlined where it absolves the healer (or tank) of any responsibility should things go wrong? Never once did I say it wasn't rude of the DPS to pull given the circumstances. So put bluntly, don't put words in my mouth.

So that's tanks can be inexperienced in baby dungeons, tanks can't be inexperienced in 71+ content, tanks can't learn big pulls in a live experience in higher level dungeons and should just stick to Trusts for that when Trusts often let you die doing that, tanks can't withhold tanking because the impatient dps can't keep it in their pants a second, 50 dungeons are okay to new tank in because that's where *you* learned, and healers can't ask for smaller pulls because Twelve forbid they want to learn healing at their pace.

Honestly, Forte, in this and other threads I've just gotten the impression you don't think people should be allowed to be new or inexperienced or uncertain if it's ever going to cause a run to go slower than what you personally expect. But that's going to happen because we have a wide range of experience and ability levels and we all get mixed up together when we get randomly matched. The best we can do is be considerate of each other and set our egos and expectations aside for a just a little bit so we can finish a run with people we'll probably never see again.

Once again this is a complete contradiction to what I've actually been saying and you're merely inferring what you want to believe. I specifically said several times now if you're new or inexperienced to practice at lower level dungeons. Which is the precise opposite of what you're accusing me of now.

And no, you aren't new at 71+. By that point you'll have gone through over 30 mandatory dungeons starting from Sastasha at least once. If you haven't learned how to double pull and rotate CDs during that process it's because you aren't trying. If you're leveling through PotD, HoH, Bozja or unlocked GNB as your first tank, the onus is on you to go into these lower level dungeons and practice. Or! There is this novel feature at level 71 called Trusts. They're specifically designed for players who want to take things slow. When Thancred can handle double pulls and Urianger can deal a whopping 12k in an AoE pull at 89, asking the tanks to double pull and the healers to DPS is effectively asking they keep up with basic AI coding. Don't believe me the Trusts can pull that off? Try it yourself.