Trust "Avatar" Mode -- Are the name changes necessary?

[MilkieTea]

You can read what I said. I said exactly that. Please unlearn your FFXIV-Forum-habit of putting words in people's mouths.

I'm not "putting words in your mouth," though. The direct conversation was as follows:

> Like, imagine seeing your friend play the game in Avatar mode, but it just says Thancred, Y'shtola, and Ryne and they're in Holm Switch. I can see plenty of confusion from newer players regarding something like that.

>> If you get confused about something like this, I don't know what to tell you... lol

>>> I'm sorry, but there are indeed newer players who don't understand the trust function. It's not as if they can look at someone playing Holm Switch with Thancred, Ryne, and Y'shtola and immediately know that access to that functionality is gated behind finishing up the MSQ and being in Avatar mode, leveling the trust avatars. Having it be "Thancred's Avatar" allows for newer players who may not understand the trust function to see that it's not just a feature they missed while playing through the story.

It's not as though we have players who don't even understand that they need to actually complete the MSQ to gain access to post-MSQ content, though, right?

>>>> People might be new, but they're not stupid. That's a very important difference.

There's no reason for the line "People might be new, but they're not stupid," if the implication isn't that only someone stupid would not be able to figure out immediately that said access to the functionality behind utilizing certain characters is MSQ-gated and is only available through the Avatar system.

There was a question there, instead of answering the question or clarifying your statement, you skirted around to pull a tiny little "gotcha!" moment. I'm going to further assume that you indeed, meant to say that only stupid people would not be able to make the connections as stated above. If that's not an accurate assumption, you can further clarify. If it is, continue to skirt around, or whatever you please.

[Shironeko_Narunyan]

I'm not "putting words in your mouth," though. The direct conversation was as follows:

> Like, imagine seeing your friend play the game in Avatar mode, but it just says Thancred, Y'shtola, and Ryne and they're in Holm Switch. I can see plenty of confusion from newer players regarding something like that.

>> If you get confused about something like this, I don't know what to tell you... lol

>>> I'm sorry, but there are indeed newer players who don't understand the trust function. It's not as if they can look at someone playing Holm Switch with Thancred, Ryne, and Y'shtola and immediately know that access to that functionality is gated behind finishing up the MSQ and being in Avatar mode, leveling the trust avatars. Having it be "Thancred's Avatar" allows for newer players who may not understand the trust function to see that it's not just a feature they missed while playing through the story.

It's not as though we have players who don't even understand that they need to actually complete the MSQ to gain access to post-MSQ content, though, right?

>>>> People might be new, but they're not stupid. That's a very important difference.

There's no reason for the line "People might be new, but they're not stupid," if the implication isn't that only someone stupid would not be able to figure out immediately that said access to the functionality behind utilizing certain characters is MSQ-gated and is only available through the Avatar system.

There was a question there, instead of answering the question or clarifying your statement, you skirted around to pull a tiny little "gotcha!" moment. I'm going to further assume that you indeed, meant to say that only stupid people would not be able to make the connections as stated above. If that's not an accurate assumption, you can further clarify. If it is, continue to skirt around, or whatever you please.

This is hilarious. I'll stop here, don't want anything to do with this. It's only gonna end in forum bans.

[MsQi]

Immersion usually being involvement in the narrative and world.. or story.

To reiterate immersion is not limited to only one story. But as I pointed out you first statement is based on a false premise.

[MilkieTea]

This is hilarious. I'll stop here, don't want anything to do with this. It's only gonna end in forum bans.

I'm unsure as to why it would end in forum bans if we've both, to this point, been relatively cordial. ^-^ But thank you for clarifying that it is indeed an accurate assumption. Have a great day! /gen

[Krotoan]

To reiterate immersion is not limited to only one story. But as I pointed out you first statement is based on a false premise.

The problem being that they are breaking their own immersion by not being able to work in the fact that "avatars" might be a thing, since the developers decided that it was not right (for whatever reason) to just crowbar in a whatif of exact duplicates?

Interesting that they made the change retroactive as well.

In any case I was mostly asking for clarification, hence the initial response being a question. Thanks for clarifying I suppose.

[swiss_Momo]

the trust NPCs in levelling mode have always been avatar copies, and not the actual Scions. That's how the system got introduced in a live letter (or was it one of the fanfests? I don't remember) and is why you're able to run dungeons on 'non canon' party compositions.
the name change is probably to make this more clear, especially now that you can end up with double Y'shtola, Urianger and G'raha in tower of Zot

[Mikey_R]

You can also make a case that, if you are someone who clicks on someone, or uses mouse over macros to heal, you can at least distinguish between the ones in your party and the other NPCs.

[Kes13a]

just curious... but is it not ALREADY "immersion breaking" to run the same thing multiple times?

[Sarnai]

The problem being that they are breaking their own immersion by not being able to work in the fact that "avatars" might be a thing, since the developers decided that it was not right (for whatever reason) to just crowbar in a whatif of exact duplicates?

Funny thing is that now we are using term Avatars for 2 different things at once, which makes it a bit amusing to me. My char summons Avatar that is a demon thingy but also my friend's avatar which are the images created by Azem stone I suppose

Also it's funny how we can't recomplete the dungeons with the same Scions and need to "summons" their "avatars" but we definitely can kill any other thing multiple times, and not their Avatar/Memento.

[einschwartz]

I get that for story purposes, each 71-90 dungeon can't include every available character, but seeing " 's Avatar" next to the names feels terrible.

While it's not really a big deal to me, I agree. It does feel a little jarring to see the word Avatar besides the trust npc names.
I can live with it, but if it gets removed would be better.