What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[Lauront]

I think we just haven't had a chance to see a lot of beings that are associated with Darkness. Maybe they all look like that and it's only our own in real life perceptions coming into play. To the people on the First, it's the angelic beings who are the true demonic personas.

In all honesty, I thought Zodiark's form was fine. They used SHB to hammer the point that simply looking like an angel doesn't imply one is benevolent, with Innocence as an extreme of this. Plus, some of the sin eaters and lightwardens themselves looked rather demonic. Zodiark by contrast has the large horns and menacing appearance, but he is a primal of salvation and also an Atlas like figure, protecting the star from corruption. I suspect Zodiark's appearance is simply a consequence of him being a primal of darkness, although given that the statues of him predate his summoning, it may have some mythological significance to the ancients as well. As in, he bears the guise of some manner of protector deity. Horned gods exist as a thing separately to demons.

Where it grated on my nerves was constantly Hydaelyn using the terms light and dark as interchangeable with good and evil (or associated concepts, like hope and despair), when they spent an entire expansion unravelling this association. It just sits weirdly. The fixation with light at this point is just dull to me.

Again, it wasn't a gamble when you know the outcome. She knew Sundering the world would put a temporary stop to the Final Days.

Hm, where did she know that from? Zodiark was what was preventing a repeat.

She heard our tales of stopping numerous world-destroying threats, she heard of us defeating Emet-Selch, who bare in mind is considered the most gifted in Aetheric manipulation out of all Ancients

Yes, coupled with seven other summoned champions, the Scions and a ton of light which the story attributed the MC being able to control due to bearing the Blessing of Light and which took a further soul shard rejoining to avoid bursting at the seams. The sundering aetherically reduced life 9 times in excess of the total amount of soul shards the WoL had rejoined. All that, plus the aid of the scions to eventually put a hole through him. And again, this is one singular individual in possession of a particularly potent ancient soul, with a lot of plot contrivances enabling said outcome. Rather exceptional compared to other sundered beings.

What she didn't know is what would happen when we returned from the past, and even then she put a plan in place in the event we failed.

An utterly futile one, because what does fleeing the star accomplish against a foe like Meteion?

She didn't know if we would be able to defeat Meteion, as her knowledge of the future ended when we returned to the present, so she tested us. If we failed, we were to flee Etherys. If we passed, then we know what happens.

This part right here is why people refer to it as a gamble, i.e. sundering the world to commit to the original timeline on the basis of an outcome she'd still need to test.

[Rulakir]

The most boring thing they could've done would be to make Zodiark or Hydaelyn the big bad, which they didn't.

Except Hydaelyn is still the antagonist to the Ancients, even moreso now given what we learned in EW. I didn't clarify this enough in my initial response as to why I felt like the narrative was gaslighting me. Her actions align more with the villains, in fact she shares numerous similarities to Hermes, but the storyline treats her as the opposite. Even saying she's the heroine of the WoL's tale is being generous since our reality is a direct result of the decisions she made, choices which led to the deaths of billions and wasn't guaranteed to save anyone.

Again, it wasn't a gamble when you know the outcome.

This is a problem because it means she knowingly sundered additional reflections for the purpose of serving as fodder to the Ascians who would rejoin them. So, if they were morally reprehensible, then so is Venat if she were purposefully trying to recreate the events that would lead to the WoL.

Should you choose not to believe that, then we have the Crystal Exarch's timeline, which Veloran in the lore forums noted, is the antithesis of the messaging of EW. They refused to accept their fate after the 8th Umbral Calamity (which was tame compared to the Final Days), labored for 200 years to undo it, and sent G'raha back in time under the belief that in doing so they would all cease to exist. His timeline is the complete failure of everything Venat sought to achieve to the extent that the 'superior' sundered, as we're led to believe, ended up being no different than their unsundered ancestors when push came to shove.

[Imperius_Relampago]

This is a problem because it means she knowingly sundered additional reflections for the purpose of serving as fodder to the Ascians who would rejoin them. So, if they were morally reprehensible, then so is Venat if she were purposefully trying to recreate the events that would lead to the WoL.

That is correct, however Venat and the Ascians had one major difference. The Ascians saw Humanity as inferior shells of what they once were, and saw us a gnats who should be stamped out. Venat truly loved Humanity, and was in pain as she watched Humanity suffer through the rejoinings. Rewatch "Cutscene #2 of the "Thou Must Live, Die and Know" quest cutscene, and pay attention to the songs lyrics as they spoken, as well as the visuals in the cutscene. Venat/Hydaelyn became more bloody, damaged and tired as time went one. This represented her watching Humanity suffer as she walked past them, ignoring their cries for help. The song playing in the background, "Answers" is a combination of Ancients, Humanity and Hydaelyn singing. The deep male voices are the Ancients during the Final Days, as they despaired and desperately hoped for Zodiark to save them, constantly calling out to the star asking "Why must we suffer?", with Hydaelyn responding "walk free". Then it cuts to Humanity being beaten with every Rejoining, echoing the cries of the ancients, but with a female voice "Why must we suffer so?", along with "Now open your eyes now that our plight is repeated", "Still deaf to our cries", and all of Hydaelyn's responses are apologetic. Near the end of the song, the Ancients and Humanity sing together (symbolising the WoL carrying the Ancients legacy, as well as the hope of Humanity), with Hydaelyn giving her famous "Hear, Feel, Think" lines inbetween them.

[Imperius_Relampago]

Hm, where did she know that from? Zodiark was what was preventing a repeat.

From our PC. They told Venat and co an entire history of FFXIV from when we arrived to Eorzea to the moment we arrived in Elpis. We were told by the Ascians that Hydaelyn Sundered the world and Zodiark. She has a second hand account of everything that would happen after she Sundered the world. On the bridge, she asked us; "In the future is the world still beautiful?" (All our options are a yes, with the last option being that we find the Unsundered World more beautiful). When we give her our answer (I chose option 1), she says she "could hear the glimmer in our eyes, and the adoration in our voice" and then she wished to know of our adventures while we waited. She even said, and I quote; "By learning about the future world, I may gain insight into future me's plans". We then told her about our adventures. Every battle, every dungeon, every sidequest, every delight. She already knew about all the MSQ stuff from when we told her, Emet-Selch and Hythlodaeus about the events leading up to Endwalker, with Emet going off in a huff at the man he becomes. She finally asked; "You, who are our future... Tell me this and tell me true. Has your journey been good? Has it been worthwhile?" before being interrupted by the archivist (Go to The Unending Journey and view the "Witness to the Spectacle" cutscene). Our very presence in the past showed Hydaelyn that Sundering the world and Zodiark would leave Etherys at peace for a time, and that choosing us, the PC, would protect the world from the threats we described when we recounted our tales to her.

It wasn't a gamble. She didn't gamble on mankind maybe living through the Sundering. After you tell her your tales of adventure, she states; "Yours is a hard and unforgiving world. Yet in spite of this, your brethren hold fast to their virtue. To know that the light of mankind's potential still shines, even in that faraway place... It gives me heart". She knew the world would be fine up until the Final Days began again. She evens says that so long as her people need help, she couldn't return to the star. When we fought Hydaelyn, we were fighting to show her that we had the strength to overcome despair. If we failed, we were to flee Etherys. If we succeeded, Hydaelyn/Venat would return to the star, as she knew that her people were finally safe in our hands. That was Hydaelyn's/Venat's final trial; To showcase our strength and resolve to protect Etherys, to ensure her people would remain safe in our care.

[Lauront]

From our PC. They told Venat and co an entire history of FFXIV from when we arrived to Eorzea to the moment we arrived in Elpis. We were told by the Ascians that Hydaelyn Sundered the world and Zodiark. She has a second hand account of everything that would happen after she Sundered the world. On the bridge, she asked us; "In the future is the world still beautiful?" (All our options are a yes, with the last option being that we find the Unsundered World more beautiful). When we give her our answer (I chose option 1), she says she "could hear the glimmer in our eyes, and the adoration in our voice" and then she wished to know of our adventures while we waited. She even said, and I quote; "By learning about the future world, I may gain insight into future me's plans". We then told her about our adventures. Every battle, every dungeon, every sidequest, every delight. She already knew about all the MSQ stuff from when we told her, Emet-Selch and Hythlodaeus about the events leading up to Endwalker, with Emet going off in a huff at the man he becomes. She finally asked; "You, who are our future... Tell me this and tell me true. Has your journey been good? Has it been worthwhile?" before being interrupted by the archivist (Go to The Unending Journey and view the "Witness to the Spectacle" cutscene). Our very presence in the past showed Hydaelyn that Sundering the world and Zodiark would leave Etherys at peace for a time, and that choosing us, the PC, would protect the world from the threats we described when we recounted our tales to her.

Okay, I am going to ask again. Where is it specifically stated that the Sundering bought them time against the Final Days, as opposed to Zodiark remaining in place as a shield? Her own henchman, the Watcher, specifically states that her summoners left Zodiark in place rather than unmaking him because of that (although bizarrely they opposed his very creation according to the same dialogue...)

It wasn't a gamble. She didn't gamble on mankind maybe living through the Sundering. After you tell her your tales of adventure, she states; "Yours is a hard and unforgiving world. Yet in spite of this, your brethren hold fast to their virtue. To know that the light of mankind's potential still shines, even in that faraway place... It gives me heart". She knew the world would be fine up until the Final Days began again. She evens says that so long as her people need help, she couldn't return to the star. When we fought Hydaelyn, we were fighting to show her that we had the strength to overcome despair. If we failed, we were to flee Etherys. If we succeeded, Hydaelyn/Venat would return to the star, as she knew that her people were finally safe in our hands. That was Hydaelyn's/Venat's final trial; To showcase our strength and resolve to protect Etherys, to ensure her people would remain safe in our care.

Yes, I am familiar with the dialogue. The fact that she is deciding it through a trial is a gamble in and of itself.