Is SCH + AST the meta?

[JanVanding]

It just isn't funny how bad WHM is and they don't even have that "but I can do lots of dps" edge anymore, SCH and SGE beat them up and took their blood Lily gil.

[lisaa]

Balanced? Really?
See P3S WHM vs AST.

Okay AST is better in p3 but you can’t judge balance just because of one mechanic. I progged on WHM until that mech and felt really comfortable. It’s not like if I was on AST we would’ve known to macrocosmos it the first time

After switching to AST I really suffered in p4p1, there is just so much to think about that I just couldn’t keep up held us back a lot. Well maybe I’m just bad and using the job as an excuse. It turned out okay in phase 2 but still I wonder if we would’ve been faster if I had stayed on WHM. But ultimately I have more fun on ast so I don’t regret it.

Anyway I just think we’re so lucky to be able to play basically any comp, even double shield. Meanwhile PLD and SMN are very weak, and phys ranged can only play BRD. And melees have some variety because comfort matters, but having RPR or MNK helps so much. Healers are really lucky and we shouldn’t ruin it by mistaking people into thinking they have to play this or that.

[Windwalker]

ast and sch offers party buffs, the other healers don't really bring much to the party.

[Risvertasashi]

I think they're all pretty balanced, they each have their advantage and disadvantage and people should just play what they are more comfortable and have fun with!

I think we're really lucky that it's like this because Tanks and DPS are not, so we should really cherish this freedom to play our favorite

It just isn't funny how bad WHM is and they don't even have that "but I can do lots of dps" edge anymore, SCH and SGE beat them up and took their blood Lily gil.

[Halfgeeek]

WHM & SGE numbers are up now that its being optimized and speed run.

https://www.fflogs.com/zone/rankings/44/#boss=82

Good see to more balance representation in the 4 healers.

[Risvertasashi]

WHM & SGE numbers are up now that its being optimized and speed run.

https://www.fflogs.com/zone/rankings/44/#boss=82

Good see to more balance representation in the 4 healers.

Kind of interesting to see how it flips from boss to boss - Sage is popular for lower bosses but not higher ones, at least not right now. I think this means we'll see Sage become the farm/speed kill healer as gear improves. Astro, meanwhile, is popular at both ends.

So, perhaps sge + ast is what it will settle on long term.

[CrimsonGunner]

Okay AST is better in p3 but you can’t judge balance just because of one mechanic. I progged on WHM until that mech and felt really comfortable. It’s not like if I was on AST we would’ve known to macrocosmos it the first time

After switching to AST I really suffered in p4p1, there is just so much to think about that I just couldn’t keep up held us back a lot. Well maybe I’m just bad and using the job as an excuse. It turned out okay in phase 2 but still I wonder if we would’ve been faster if I had stayed on WHM. But ultimately I have more fun on ast so I don’t regret it.

Anyway I just think we’re so lucky to be able to play basically any comp, even double shield. Meanwhile PLD and SMN are very weak, and phys ranged can only play BRD. And melees have some variety because comfort matters, but having RPR or MNK helps so much. Healers are really lucky and we shouldn’t ruin it by mistaking people into thinking they have to play this or that.

saying that is basically ignoring reality right now in a hard way, almost delusional really.

right now the hard facts are:

1) ast has more and better mp regen tools then whm - white mage literally has no means to recover mp better then ast in any sort of way: lucid dream is shared, thin air dont replenish mp just save it while ast has astrodyn which is a second lucid exclusive to him, draw replenish same mp as assize only every 30 second while assize every 45s.(not including many free mp ogcd to use instead of gcd heals unlike whm)

2) ast and sage keep their gauges after death, sage can regenerate while being dead and whm cannot.(also whm charge every 30s and sage every20s)

3) ast mp spells cost less then whm and even cast faster then whm.

4) ast macrocosmoss is a tool that can be used for any situation(dungeons, trials, raids...) in any given time to its max usage, while whm lilybell can only be used on 15s multi hit waves that include hitting whm making it super niche and exclusive to only useable in specific moments that hardly happen in normal content and much more macrocosmos can be triggered manually while lilybell cannot.

5) whm lilies and blood lily were never adjusted to changes of endwalker and the increasae of potency from glare and other spells.

6) whm thin air changes make rez a double weave a must so if u wish to keep gcd going u must double weave but if u don't do that u must clip on every moment u need to rez.

so basically u progg with it and its comfy for u fine but saying whm is fine while the reality is that its a mess and so underperforming is basically denying the truth lisaa and it doesnt matter if u like it right now or not its the undeniable truth.

maybe not a mess but extremely underperforming and his gcd are mp heavy hits to what he can replenish making him less then ideal prog healer no matter how u look at it.

the only thing going for whm against ast is the fact is minor arcana change gave ast such a button bloat its making ast a mess but if it were to change to 1 button maybe along regular draw, it can improve ast drastically making ast better in every form and way both speed runs and progg friendly.

[WhiteFlow]

Kind of interesting to see how it flips from boss to boss - Sage is popular for lower bosses but not higher ones, at least not right now. I think this means we'll see Sage become the farm/speed kill healer as gear improves. Astro, meanwhile, is popular at both ends.

So, perhaps sge + ast is what it will settle on long term.

Try to swap the regions too. Quite funny. (Maybe the amount of data is too low)

But i am unsure what kind of measure points you guys using? Speed of the top 50 groups? I think it still bit to early to make any conclusions about the meta (and maybe what kind of meta? for prog or speed?), but i can expect AST/SCH or SGE/SCH for later. (was quite surprised about the SGE/SCH comp)

right now the hard facts are:

I laugh hard man.

[Acece]

Sch has the niche of strong shields, disjointed heals, and a speed boost. Sage has great free healing and mitigation, has excellent damage, and has a great synergy with other healers. Ast has excellent healing, great range cause of earthly star, shields that stack, infinite mp, and white hole mechs don't exist for ast. Meanwhile whm has.... a free raise every min, is easy, and has good damage(I think have not checked individual healer damage.) It's no wonder whm is so bad lol.

[LuciaMirain]

Okay AST is better in p3 but you can’t judge balance just because of one mechanic. I progged on WHM until that mech and felt really comfortable. It’s not like if I was on AST we would’ve known to macrocosmos it the first time

After switching to AST I really suffered in p4p1, there is just so much to think about that I just couldn’t keep up held us back a lot. Well maybe I’m just bad and using the job as an excuse. It turned out okay in phase 2 but still I wonder if we would’ve been faster if I had stayed on WHM. But ultimately I have more fun on ast so I don’t regret it.

Anyway I just think we’re so lucky to be able to play basically any comp, even double shield. Meanwhile PLD and SMN are very weak, and phys ranged can only play BRD. And melees have some variety because comfort matters, but having RPR or MNK helps so much. Healers are really lucky and we shouldn’t ruin it by mistaking people into thinking they have to play this or that.

We progged on WHM/SCH and once we got to THAT mechanic we simply healer lb3d. Even with me popping temperance, two raptures and a cure 3 I still couldnt get the entire party up in time. Meanwhile AST pops macrocosmos and just boom. :P I was planning to play AST this expansion but after dragging it through the story and the first raids I felt it was too buttonbloated to feel good for me. So went back to WHM, reluctantly since it is so awful at this point. As a reactive healer those are my choices atm - buttonbloated and extremely busy but very powerful OR dumbed down lacking ogcds but still viable.