Are you the loud minority? (Healer feedback)

[Mortex]

Nope nope you did not! I am not so good with English and the conveying of things in it. I can also sound saucy or feisty because I say things in a very direct way.

Not off topic though! I like reading big meaty posts then responding, writing is fun. Many thanks though!

I too would like them to share information. I feel they know there is dissatisfaction with healers yet out of traditionalism refuse to admit that they have failed in this regard. If such data were to be shared it might corroborate my own personal experiences with friends and family.

Seeing them buff gcd heals is one such of many of the examples! It shows semblance of being out of touch. We do not gcd heal where able at level 80, I am unsure how buffed cure 1 is going to be useful at 90 but that was what they chose. Temperance feels like slap too, while 10% mitigation is nice why does it buff "healing magic" instead of "healing actions". No one should be casting cure 2 at level 80 unless progging and things have gone great googlie mooglie.

The thing about sharing information stopped around mid heavensward. Back then they actually told us in advance what jobs got what potency changes. And some of them we’re really bad and some jobs didn’t get any buff even though they desperately did need these buffs. So people ofc gave them fire for it. So they did decide only on patch release to give out infos. And this is also the reason older player react allergic too the “just wait till…..” line. Because the track record they had back then for actually fixing the problem even when a majority of the player did point out that these buffs/nerf or nothing at all of the jobs that did needed desperate help back then was really not there. And almost all the time it did happen how the player’s told them it would.

[Shironeko_Narunyan]

I'm on Elemental DC, which is located in Japan.

Even when the "role in need" is something different than healer, queueing as that role leads to a wait time, whereas as healer, even if not the needed role, the longest I ever have to wait is a few seconds. This is either a bug, or a direct manipulation of the algorithm, to "make it more fair" for other roles, rewards-wise (hint: whatever they tried to achieve there, it doesn't work).

It doesn't matter for me why it is that healers are difficult to find.
It matters though that there is a bottleneck, and changing the role didn't work in the past, I wouldn't expect it to suddenly work in the future. I'd look at the group structure, maybe expand the light party to 5 or 6 players, with the new slots being for DPS.

[Mortex]

I'm on Elemental DC, which is located in Japan.

Even when the "role in need" is something different than healer, queueing as that role leads to a wait time, whereas as healer, even if not the needed role, the longest I ever have to wait is a few seconds. This is either a bug, or a direct manipulation of the algorithm, to "make it more fair" for other roles, rewards-wise (hint: whatever they tried to achieve there, it doesn't work).

It doesn't matter for me why it is that healers are difficult to find.
It matters though that there is a bottleneck, and changing the role didn't work in the past, I wouldn't expect it to suddenly work in the future. I'd look at the group structure, maybe expand the light party to 5 or 6 players, with the new slots being for DPS.

What most people also forget is we always need 1/2 healer to start any content at all, and people gonna use this ofc to get a quick invite. Even I hate playing healer but I find myself doing it for a lot more stuff (mentor being the worst example of what duty finder stuff you never should touch if you don’t play healer) because a healer that has no idea what the hell he is doing on this role will cost you sometimes even hours in dungeons or even extreme. At least tanks almost never get one shot in content were you got down synched. And ofc bad dps make the dungeon go longer but you don’t wipe 5 times I a row because a healer plays like blindfolded.

[Halfgeeek]

I posted this OP a few months ago, without much end-game experience, in the pov of a newbie.

Since EW, I've had the opportunity to experience current end-game content at min-ilvl, and using the PF to obtain 580 gear sets for tank, dps & healer. I've thought on this topic, since it's not exactly a simple one (difficult to please the masses, whilst catering to the core).

But I have to agree, many of you who complain about the simple DPS kit are correct.. though partially.

Healing EX1 & 2 with randoms in week 1 was a lot of fun as people mess up mechanics constantly. Even now in farm parties, you get the odd wipes, though its becoming less & less demanding on the healer, as expected. People over-gear, they know all the mechanics. There's little left for a healer to do besides spamming 1-2 and chase after higher DPS.

But this malaise is not a problem with the healing kit itself. It's a flaw in the encounter design. As a healer, you thrive (or the demand put on you to perform) in chaos, but as time goes on, encounters being set mechanics, little to no randomness, means order is achieved, moreso if you're with a static.

The obvious suggestion is to give healers a more complex DPS kit. But I understand why YoshiP thinks its a bad idea. Complex DPS kit mixed with healer chaos of early content experience will raise the barrier of entry higher for the majority of players.

More dynamic encounter design would be better for every role, making the content stay chaotic (& fun, challenging) for longer. But I think devs are afraid to go down this route, diverging away from the formula that worked for them so far.

SAGE is a huge missed opportunity. Other roles have jobs with varying degrees of complexity. Right now for healers, all have simple DPS options. SAGE could have been that DPS-focused healer devs promised, with a fancy DPS rotation & kit but in the end, its just a simple on the DPS front, IMO. Sad panda.

[AFuzzyMu11in]

I posted this OP a few months ago, without much end-game experience, in the pov of a newbie.

Since EW, I've had the opportunity to experience current end-game content at min-ilvl, and using the PF to obtain 580 gear sets for tank, dps & healer. I've thought on this topic, since it's not exactly a simple one (difficult to please the masses, whilst catering to the core).

But I have to agree, many of you who complain about the simple DPS kit are correct.. though partially.

Healing EX1 & 2 with randoms in week 1 was a lot of fun as people mess up mechanics constantly. Even now in farm parties, you get the odd wipes, though its becoming less & less demanding on the healer, as expected. People over-gear, they know all the mechanics. There's little left for a healer to do besides spamming 1-2 and chase after higher DPS.

But this malaise is not a problem with the healing kit itself. It's a flaw in the encounter design. As a healer, you thrive (or the demand put on you to perform) in chaos, but as time goes on, encounters being set mechanics, little to no randomness, means order is achieved, moreso if you're with a static.

The obvious suggestion is to give healers a more complex DPS kit. But I understand why YoshiP thinks its a bad idea. Complex DPS kit mixed with healer chaos of early content experience will raise the barrier of entry higher for the majority of players.

More dynamic encounter design would be better for every role, making the content stay chaotic (& fun, challenging) for longer. But I think devs are afraid to go down this route, diverging away from the formula that worked for them so far.

SAGE is a huge missed opportunity. Other roles have jobs with varying degrees of complexity. Right now for healers, all have simple DPS options. SAGE could have been that DPS-focused healer devs promised, with a fancy DPS rotation & kit but in the end, its just a simple on the DPS front, IMO. Sad panda.

I agree with this.

[glamazon]

No because the first priority of healers is to heal so even with a fun robust dps kit we will be healing new content because no one will know the mechanics. We will heal and then when everyone knows the fight we will actually have a dps kit worth using and our healing kit will still be used just not as much because it won’t be needed.

Why they don’t get this is beyond me. There won’t be a barrier to entry just a lot les one button glare spamming. That’s not fun.

[Shuuli]

People who say healing is easy never done Shinryu on MINE (minimum item level, no echo) with the double heal check.

I don't think the problem is that it is inconsistent. There are times when everything is fine and you just get bored of spamming one dps button between a few hint of heals. But when there is a bump in the process, its a huge freaking shitshow.

[Halfgeeek]

No because the first priority of healers is to heal so even with a fun robust dps kit we will be healing new content because no one will know the mechanics. We will heal and then when everyone knows the fight we will actually have a dps kit worth using and our healing kit will still be used just not as much because it won’t be needed.

Why they don’t get this is beyond me. There won’t be a barrier to entry just a lot les one button glare spamming. That’s not fun.

It's because of this:

Enrage mechanics exist to be a barrier on skill, or group performance.

If healers had a complex DPS kit, during the prog or early phase, the vast majority of healer players will not be able to perform well in their DPS checks, with their focus undoubtedly shifted to healing & saving allies from their mistake. This we both understand.

Most grps would fail the prog and it would very likely be the fault of those avg healer players.

But devs want a higher clear rate. They would have to lower the enrage barrier to compensate for healers under-performing.

What is the outcome of that? If you think it through, with the pov that devs view the pressures placed on healers as already being "enough".

That's why personally, I think 1 out of the 4 healers, being SGE as its new, should have been devoted to a complex DPS healer job by the devs, to cater to players who seek that, while the other 3 healers remain "viable and fun" for the masses who play healers. Rather than having all 4 healers with a complex DPS kit and then changing their entire encounter balance around the lowest common denominator.

[QooEr]

It's because of this:

Enrage mechanics exist to be a barrier on skill, or group performance.

If healers had a complex DPS kit, during the prog or early phase, the vast majority of healer players will not be able to perform well in their DPS checks, with their focus undoubtedly shifted to healing & saving allies from their mistake. This we both understand.

Most grps would fail the prog and it would very likely be the fault of those avg healer players

thats not how prog works though. when progging, dps does not matter in the slightest unless theres some add phase with a dps check, because to prog is to just progress through the fight to learn the mechanics.

Once you get to enrage, prog is over. When youre finally trying to actually clear the fight is when dps starts to matter. and by that point, the whole group has seen the entire fight. everyone ostensibly knows the mechanics and everyone has done the earlier phases of the fight enough times to figure out healing patterns and the like.


extra dps buttons on healers wouldnt affect prog

[Insertusernamehere]

I don't understand why replacing VUL stacks with damage down stack good idea?

In dungeon it still punishes everyone.. because fight will take more time and if they multiple stacks suicide & rez might be more practical less dps loss.
In savage i guess it doesn't matter what kind of stack you get.. you will probably die

If we are going for this system we should also remove rez option in boss fight or it does not make any sense.