Are melds and super gear really necessary?

[Xakery]

Who doesn't have an ifrit bow by now ...

you'd be surprised. I know several "end-game" linkshells who wipe to Ifrit over and over again or barely win on Ifrit. Getting my 7 weapons was a combo of ls events and pickup parties.

[Meatdawg]

you'd be surprised. I know several "end-game" linkshells who wipe to Ifrit over and over again or barely win on Ifrit. Getting my 7 weapons was a combo of ls events and pickup parties.

If you wipe on Ifrit over and over you are not an "end-game" LS.

[Molly_Millions]

The reason this has come up (Xak is in my LS) is that a lot of us in my shell refuse to fight moogles most days because we lack the proper equipment to do enough DD for a solid run. Quite a few of us lack Ifrit's bow, myself included. That problem is exacerbated in my case by the fact that I never play arc, so I'm not the best at arc DD to begin with. I agree that for armor, double and triple melds are nice, but not necessary. I don't think the same can be said of weapons. I think an Ifrit weapon or at least a double melded weapon (Ifrit weapons are almost as powerful as a triple meld or a really good double.) When the problem is not enough DD, upgraded weapons can be the answer.

[Bajo]

Good gear is meant to do one of two things:

1. Supplement a lack of player skill.
2. Accentuate player skill.

if you lack skill you lack skill, gear does not help skill, ppl who complain about their gear have no skill, ppl with elite gear probably still have no skill, skill>gear

[Molly_Millions]

if you lack skill you lack skill, gear does not help skill, ppl who complain about their gear have no skill, ppl with elite gear probably still have no skill, skill>gear

I disagree, so does mathematics:

(pulled these numbers out of my ass for sake of argument)

Skillfull player:
70 dps +20 from ifrit's bow = 90 dps
70 dps +0 (no ifrits bow) = 70 dps

unskilled player:
50 dps +0 (no ifrits bow) = 50 dps
50 dps +13 from ifrit's bow = 63 dps


The unskilled player still does not do as much dd as the skilled player w/out Ifrits bow, but it DOES help.

[Delsus]

SOmeone said you should have atleast 1 meld on every piece of gear, ok on ifrit shortly after materia was released, I was hitting for 26ish dmg on ifrit (i dont remember the exact numbers) when I melded +18str to my hands my damaged REMAINED THE SAME.

With materia its either atleast 2x meld or its not worth it if someone can TANK ifrit in a santa suit/bikini/reindeer suit there is something wrong.

This has been brought up many times and its pretty much known that weapons affect damage alot, other gear doesn't help as much because of the high stats we have now, when you are sitting at 250 STR, it takes alot to notice any differance.

We also don't know the formulae for damage and stats so everything is speculation.

[syntaxlies]

With the HQ change and jobs, it might be more than possible.

HQ change will have nothing to do with it.

[tachi]

We all use the ifrit/moogle baseline for DPS and the worthiness of gear, we should remember that although DH was a run-n-gun situation the next 2 instances most likely won't have that option. And if you remember DH was chock full of r50-55 lvl mobs in swarms, the returns on gear is scaled by dlvl so that as the higher the mob the less return you see on your gear. When you look at the returns on a nice double melded fully pimped out set vs equal rank mobs the argument that gear has little effect is no longer valid.

I expect the 2 new instances to promote larger impacts from gear then we are used to now. Also this impact of gear on the tank is a monster difference when the mob rank is much closer, talking about going from taking 200/hit in trash gear to taking 75/hit in pro gear. Yes I'm sure ppl will eventually be clearing with raindeer suits at some point but the first few groups through most likely will have very top notch gear.

[Matsume]

I disagree, so does mathematics:

(pulled these numbers out of my ass for sake of argument)

Skillfull player:
70 dps +20 from ifrit's bow = 90 dps
70 dps +0 (no ifrits bow) = 70 dps

unskilled player:
50 dps +0 (no ifrits bow) = 50 dps
50 dps +13 from ifrit's bow = 63 dps


The unskilled player still does not do as much dd as the skilled player w/out Ifrits bow, but it DOES help.

The unskilled player can't do any damage if he dies so many times that the party leader ousts him. whereas the skilled player may die once and get a raise, the raise would be wasted on an unskilled player.

[Molly_Millions]

We all use the ifrit/moogle baseline for DPS and the worthiness of gear, we should remember that although DH was a run-n-gun situation the next 2 instances most likely won't have that option. And if you remember DH was chock full of r50-55 lvl mobs in swarms, the returns on gear is scaled by dlvl so that as the higher the mob the less return you see on your gear. When you look at the returns on a nice double melded fully pimped out set vs equal rank mobs the argument that gear has little effect is no longer valid.

I expect the 2 new instances to promote larger impacts from gear then we are used to now. Also this impact of gear on the tank is a monster difference when the mob rank is much closer, talking about going from taking 200/hit in trash gear to taking 75/hit in pro gear. Yes I'm sure ppl will eventually be clearing with raindeer suits at some point but the first few groups through most likely will have very top notch gear.

that's a good point! Worthy of investigating, for sure.