*Spoilers* Anyone feel joining Emet would have been better

[YianKutku]

Given that the Bureau of the Architect is constantly dealing with new creations, it's not unreasonable to think that older creations would be left unexamined by newcomers due to time constraints. It's not like a bureaucrat who signs on at a large depot or storehouse is going to be able to suddenly be able to account for everything that's ever been stored on the shelves there. They're too busy signing in triplicate the 800 concepts for new sharks and what not.

Hythlodaeus is not a simple new recruit to the Bureau of the Architect. He is literally the chief of the Bureau of the Architect. If the bureau has no on-boarding process for the new head of the entire department, and there is no way to easily look up past records, then the bureau is a terribly-organized place that has even more unfortunate implications for the systems the Amaurotines have put into place to play god for the planet.

I'm actually being generous to Hythlodaeus here, in that I'm attributing his ignorance of Elpis flowers due to systemic issues, rather than because Hythlodaeus is a bad leader. If the only records anyone can conceivably find about the people who know about Elpis flowers and dynamis are buried deep within the Bureau of the Architect records, that Hythlodaeus never even considered looking through, then they might as well not be there at all.

Through the course of this questline we also learn that the Convocation members are all specialists in different fields, so it's no surprise that an Emet-selch specialist doesn't know about a mysterious energy that almost no one has the means or desire to manipulate. Though it is a narrative surprise because he's a big deal to us, but it's ultimately an emotional conflation.

Emet-Selch sounded very affronted that not only did he know nothing about dynamis, but nobody told him about it. If this is supposed to be Emet-Selch being rational, then that means he should have been told about it, either as a general member of the Convocation or in his capacity as Emet-Selch. And since he hasn't been told, that means there is nobody capable of telling him up until Hermes.

If this is supposed to be Emet-Selch being irrational, well, that answers the question in the OP as well, since this is not a person I would be willing to join, lest his petty grumpiness lead to even more dangerous situations.

As for there being no way to contact the others who know about Dynamis... it's an idea that has no strength to stand under scrutiny. Elpis is a facility with rules and records. The Flower was created there, recorded there, and researched there. The names of the researchers would be in their records. The data on the flower would also be in their records.

I'd like to mention that this is the same Elpis where the head of the facility created a familiar utilizing a little-known and heretofore non-useful aspect of the universe, made several copies of that familiar and networked them together, then sent those copies out into the universe, and told nobody about it until we confronted him after we managed to find a witness. There are no records about Meteion; Hermes declined to submit the concept to the Bureau of the Architect because Meteion is allegedly "still in testing" (which is fine), while also sending Meteia into the greater universe (which is not fine). This contravenes the stated rules of Elpis, and yet nobody really cared about Hermes doing this stuff until it all went pear-shaped.

Well, not precisely the stated Rules As Written, which limits the scope of new creations regarding Etheirys. But I feel that it's certainly contravening Rules As Intended, since if a creation has not gone through enough testing to be let loose onto Etheirys, it should follow that it has also not gone through enough testing to be let loose onto the universe in which Etheirys resides.

The statement that Ancient Amaurotine society has enough rules and records that being able to find obscure former researchers or their recorded notes is possible, much less simple, is the one that does not stand under scrutiny, if taken in context with what we're also shown in the course of the narrative. Clearly to the Amaurotines, the rules are enforced through decorum, and if someone were to break the rules, they'd just get a disapproving glance and snide comment at most. This does not strike me as a system that would be conscientious enough to have meticulous and easily accessible records.

[Vyrerus]

easily accessible

At the time we are sent to Elpis, within that trip to the past, we were sent to a precise day by the auspices of the scriptwriter fate. While we meet Emet-selch and Hythlodaeus, and we know the offices they hold, we know no big details about the duties of said offices nor how long either of them have held those offices. If you've ever been elected, promoted, or placed into a leadership position to fill someone else's shoes, then you would realize that you don't get the 4-1-1 on everything in your domain on day 1. Sometimes not even year 1, depending on the gravity of the office. Then there's also the fact that in a lot of jobs, leadership position or otherwise, there's a lot to the job but there are operations and necessities that are so infrequent as to be forgotten. Even by veterans. Compare and contrast with a submarine captain. The captain has to know every system of the boat in a general sense, but has to delegate specific responsibilities to lower officers who then carry out actually working everything with their different divisions. Hythlodaeus could be the most competent Chief of the Bureau of the Architect that the Amaurotines ever had, and he probably still wouldn't know the skinny on each every creation ever submitted. It's a huge operation.

Mmm, don't misunderstand me. I do not mean it is an emotional conflation for Emet-selch. I meant it is one for the player. "Wow he doesn't know, I'm shocked! This must be a really mysterious force." Something in that vein. But as we see in this portion of the MSQ, the Convocation don't even work together. Later on in Pandaemonium we get even more of a suggestion that they are akin to the Sharlayan Forum, and they don't work together till they call a meeting to do just that. It still makes sense that no one told Emet, because Dynamis does not pertain to any of the Convocation's jobs at this point in time. Serves him right too, just standing there not calling up Grani or anything, monologuing into memory erasure. SMH

I'll point out, as you have pointed out, Hermes is the leader of Elpis. Leaders often abuse positions of authority to bend and break rules. Subordinates do not call them out for fear of loss of position or loss of potential increase in rank or pay. It's not really a commentary on how lax rules are in Elpis, but moreso that Hermes is beholden to no one there. There is no one who can, or wishes to, enforce the rules on him.


Also, I'll state that it is merely plot contrivance that the researchers are kept obscure. Like I said earlier, it would have been better if the lines were written to be that Dynamis was Hermes' personal discovery without mentioning anyone else. However vaguely they were mentioned. If I'm supposed to embrace the vagaries of Venat/Hydaelyn retroactively, then I am going to embrace the vagaries about other segments of the plot too. And if they are spiny and shifty and questionable, then I will question them and point them out. This is the case here. Hermes is not the only Ancient well versed in Dynamis.