Endwalker was "meh" (for reasons other than technical issues)

[elioaiko]

I agree and disagree.

The pacing was off but considering that the dev team wanted to finish the story once and for all so they can move onto a brand new one without the original storyline of the current holding them back, it was gonna get a bit messy.

I thought the Elpis part was extremely interesting lore wise and the trio: Hyhlo, Emet, and Venat played very well to each other.

The whole Zodiark dying was interesting as having him as the final boss would have been super predictable. I thought Meteion was a good villain and gave us some insight of what really caused the The Final Days.

As for Garlemald, it was pretty frustrating and honestly did Alphy dirty. Garleans acted accordingly because they were told their whole life that everyone else was beneath them and that we were "savages". Quintus was stuck in the past and he couldn\\\\'t live with that. Jullus was proof that once he got to know you, he struggled with even hurting you. It\\\\'s frustrating but this is coming from a nation that\\\\'s pride is stronger than being realistically.

Their literal home was ravaged, Eorzeans wanted to help and all he think is pride? Your people are dying and becoming monsters. If the writers wanted to push the point forward they honestly should have just let the Garleans die off as tragedy of why clinging onto nation pride is fatalistic. Eorzeans have been challenged and have made amends from their mistakes, willing to show change.

For the same reasons that people say Quintus poked holes in Alphy\\\\'s statement, he too had holes in his. He is in NO way to refuse their help and even goes as far to try to use hostages and steal their supplies? What did he think was going to happen? He was aware that trying to collar the WoL would have been pointless and was too strong for them, so why even try it? Not to mention attacking the same people trying to help you only puts you in a more precarious position. You\\\\'d think that your captiol destroyed and your people dying to the cold and starvation would make you think about twice about continuing the same tactic of attacking and subjugating would work?

Side quests are the same but with new ones to burn time. I don\\\\'t mind since they\\\\'re optional anyway.

The moon bit was fine. It shows that there\\\\'s a disconnect with the Loporits and how they perceived human life. But it was enduring tbh, because they were created to save humanity had everything else failed and only want to understand. But also they were cute.

Overall, I thought that the ending was a good way to tie things off. Zenos be was meh and he could have honestly stayed dead after Stormblood. I get it he lives for the thrill of battling a worthy opponent but it\\\\'s weak comparing to what the WoL just had to go through.

[Theodric]

In regards to Garlemald, the point of distrust stems from the simple fact that the Garleans have never been left alone. They're unable to wield aether, which made them easy targets and they started out as peaceful farmers just looking to work to land. Yet bit by bit, they had their territory stolen and were forced to head to the frigid, inhospitable wasteland to the north. Despite that, they were still forced to fight against invaders and do whatever was needed to survive.

That hardened them - understandably so. Most people can't fathom the idea of nearly being wiped out and having to do whatever it takes to survive.

When they finally found themselves in a position of dominance, they began to reverse their fortunes - but they genuinely believed in the cause of bringing peace and prosperity to every corner of the world. It just so happened that their goal was actively sabotaged by a certain Ascian.

It's also not unreasonable for Garlean soldiers and civilians alike to suspect compromised motives from a former enemy showing up to 'help'. Let's not forget that Eorzeans exploited the Isle of Val as a way to get around Kugane's trade tariffs, actively sabotaging Hingashi's livelihood in the process.

[AceofRains]

Endwalker to me was the response to the excellence of Shadow Bringers. However the excellence of Shadow Bringers is made the the fact that we were taken outside of our normal world to tell a the story of another world. Returning to the source meant returning to the main story and finishing it off with what we learned in the First. I treat these expansions more like a singular pair rather than saying one was better than the other because the systems are more cohesive and fleshed out, like trusts, and alternative quest styles- as compared to the previous expansions.

I also want to respond to the idea that any of the Scions should have died. No. There’s no narrative compelling reason to do this. Rather you should realize that all of the Scions are fighting because of the respective people they have lost. Hauchefant for WoL, Papalymo for Lyse, Moenbryda for Urianger, Minfilia for Thancred, Louisoux for the Twins. Even Graha Tia first had to carry the weight of literally everyone perishing before he moved the Crystal Tower to the First. Those who died were either Scions or close enough to damn near be a Scion. So let’s not pretend like important human people haven’t been dying off, when even the Satrap of Radz-at-Han was swallowed whole. Yeah sure, we had some fake outs along the way, but have lost plenty of good people that killing the party members that are central to the story is dumb and pointless. Knowing that the party would survive the final battle because plot devices were in place, I still felt the gravity and emotion of losing them and really broke down when the twins made their sacrifice.

To address stealth quests. I actually like them especially for the solo experience. I almost wish they had more of it during earlier xpacs. I more liked the Thancred mission than the player ones. I really liked being low profile in Deus Ex so it felt cool to play with that thematic while controlling the appropriate Scion. Alternatively the In from the Cold quest felt a little too unguided with little capacity to actually be stealthy other than trying to avoid enemy cone of vision.

Again to drive it home, it’s not like one expac here is that much better than the other. Objectively the writing was just as good and simply continued the narrative, we got more, and I’m never going to complain about that. However, FFXIV has grown stale over the years for me. Being on board since 1.0, I’m so happy to see where it’s all come to, but I’m also jaded because for almost a decade I’ve known the pattern of fetch quest, MSQ, level all jobs, raid, ect, ect. With the end of MSQ what I’m looking for in the future is more content that shakes things up. Maybe a new Bozja type thing that allows the use of a subjob, or some kind of gimmick idk. Mostly I think it’s just me getting older and not leaning into gaming as much as I used too.

[Theodric]

I think there's plenty of compelling reasons as to why a Scion could or should have permanently died. If the intention is to have a second coming of the apocalypse, then having not a single major character perish doesn't really make it much of an apocalypse as far as I'm concerned.

It also gets rather tiresome to see the likes of Moenbryda paraded around as a tragic death. For those of us who have been playing all along, not only do we not necessarily care...it was an event that happened almost a decade ago.

The message of 'moving on from the past' and 'you can't bring back what is lost' also falls flat when the major characters repeatedly evade death and in some cases come back from it.

[KizuyaKatogami]

I think there's plenty of compelling reasons as to why a Scion could or should have permanently died. If the intention is to have a second coming of the apocalypse, then having not a single major character perish doesn't really make it much of an apocalypse as far as I'm concerned.

It also gets rather tiresome to see the likes of Moenbryda paraded around as a tragic death. For those of us who have been playing all along, not only do we not necessarily care...it was an event that happened almost a decade ago.

The message of 'moving on from the past' and 'you can't bring back what is lost' also falls flat when the major characters repeatedly evade death and in some cases come back from it.

I second this. It’s especially annoying when you realize a big theme since the start of the game has been sacrifice, and sacrifice for the greater good. We’ve seen that with numerous characters and they decide to do it this expansion but then bring them all back, basically nullifying all of those feels and emotions they gave us when they said their pseudo goodbyes, it was all pointless. Even the main song lyric of this is expansion is “Loss,Fire”Faith” yet none of this seems to apply to the main cast. They’re always the exception when it comes to themes and consequences. Always winning whether it be through plot armor or plot convenience, never having to sacrifice or have consequences for their actions. A lot of people seem to forget the whole Yshtola plot line of her life force slowly sapping away from HW. Funny how that’s never been mentioned again isn’t it?

[Conundrum]

SNIP

I was also completely unimpressed with everything but the spectacle moments in EW. Not just the things you mentioned, but the whole reason for the Final Days being something new and even retconing previous info we had. The defenders say "oh FF does that all the time", doesn't make it good writing or story telling.

As to your edit, don't bother arguing with the glassy eyed fanboys who attack anyone who doesn't think everything Squenix ***** out is pure gold. We both know it's pointless.

[KizuyaKatogami]

I was also completely unimpressed with everything but the spectacle moments in EW. Not just the things you mentioned, but the whole reason for the Final Days being something new and even retconing previous info we had. The defenders say "oh FF does that all the time", doesn't make it good writing or story telling.

As to your edit, don't bother arguing with the glassy eyed fanboys who attack anyone who doesn't think everything Squenix ***** out is pure gold. We both know it's pointless.

Well said.

[Silver-Strider]

So let’s not pretend like important human people haven’t been dying off, when even the Satrap of Radz-at-Han was swallowed whole.

Ah yes, he was so important to the story. Standing on the sidelines while we spoke to Vytra. Truly an important character. Please, I don't even remember the dude's name since he was so unimportant narratively that it might as well have been a random civilian. He had no character other than being a public figure that Vytra acted thru and that was the extent of him. Zenos had more character than that dude did so to call him "important" is laughable.

[Cithaerias_pyropina]

I think there's plenty of compelling reasons as to why a Scion could or should have permanently died. If the intention is to have a second coming of the apocalypse, then having not a single major character perish doesn't really make it much of an apocalypse as far as I'm concerned.

It also gets rather tiresome to see the likes of Moenbryda paraded around as a tragic death. For those of us who have been playing all along, not only do we not necessarily care...it was an event that happened almost a decade ago.

The message of 'moving on from the past' and 'you can't bring back what is lost' also falls flat when the major characters repeatedly evade death and in some cases come back from it.

We also only knew Moenbryda for what seemed like 5 quests, at least that's what it felt like for me. Hardly time to develop any long standing feelings toward a character. Especially since her appearance was so sudden.

[BrokentoothMarch]

I found it very weak. The new quest mechanic was an immense annoyance, a lot of very important things were dismissed as mundane (I was especially taken aback from how it was just plain accepted we can go to the moon like that), Alphinaud returned to the annoying little gnat I hated in ARR, comic relief was unwelcome when tragedy struck just moments before, sacrifices felt cheapened and we literally beat Metei with the power of friendship.

All in all, just slightly above Stormblood in terms of quality in my opinion. Maybe equal. Which would peg both of them just above ARR. Doesn't even come close to ShB. I also take extreme umbrage with the many people here that think disliking the story means someone "missed the point" or "hasn't played the game." The former doesn't even matter because it's a writer's job to convey the point in a way that's clear, yet classy. The latter is an accusation born of a fanboy's tantrum. I'm very disappointed in how people are handling dissident opinions this expansion.