Spoiler, Sploilers, and more Spoilers

[KizuyaKatogami]

You don't know me. I don't accept whatever is put before me at all, which is why I left WoW after playing it the majority of my adult life. I think long time XIV players are just spoiled and anything less than perfection leads to whining.

Don’t see how criticism is really whining. People critique so that things can get better. Considering this expansion was delayed for 6-7 months, the fact we got what we got is extremely disappointing. Even if we discard the story, the amount of reused gear is disgusting and the fact they’re even reusing themes for dungeons is even worse. The story is just a bad offender because that’s typically the strong suit of this game, so considering even that was lacking after all this…yikes. Also, they could get another music person instead of just one guy.

Then there's the other side. People who do nothing but criticize and pull apart every little thing as if its their sole purpose in life. I have a friend like this and I genuinely have to wonder if they enjoy anything at all. It's downright toxic behavior and its kinda miserable being around people like this.

Idea in meme format

I dont think anyone here is saying people cant enjoy things or the story. People are allowed to feel how they feel so your meme kind of falls flat for me. Maybe take your own advice and allow people to critique things if thats what they enjoy? Instead of trying to shut them up lmao. Since that is indeed what your meme is implying.

[Lium]

I’ve said this before in different threads but, the antagonist of the story is Despair, not Meteion. Meteion exists as a gameplay mechanic. We as players have to have something to stab or shoot at in the final fight because above all, this is a video game, not a novel.

Some of the criticism in this thread I think is warranted and I agree with some of it. Such as the pacing which is something I said was a problem when I first started playing this a week ago. (Everything from 80-85 was a slog and I kept falling asleep during some of the cutscenes.)

However, other criticism leaves me wondering if some people even played the same game as me. I totally get that everyone has their own opinion. What’s great to some may be terrible to others and vice versa. That’s life. But there are moments when I can tell someone just so thoroughly missed the point.

Now, I will say this. As a writer I usually don’t like to introduce new characters so late in the story and then reveal they were responsible for everything bad that’s happened over the entire saga, even if it’s a video game and we have to have someone to fight. I think making the final boss in the story should be a character that’s already been established. By the time I got to the moon I was thinking Hydaelyn was the main bad guy and that was going to be the big reveal. All the signs were there. Such as Krile hearing “the sound” before Hydaelyn took her over. And the loporitts or however you spell it, seemingly scheming behind your back. That’s probably something I would have done. Use an existing thread to tie everything together.

That’s why Shadowbringers worked so well. Exarch was revealed to be G’raha Tia. Emet-Selch was the main villain and was someone who has been referenced since ARR, just as Solus and not as an Ascian. So there was nothing too far out of left field and it worked.

I will also say it may have been more impactful if the Final Days were caused by humankind’s despair and not necessarily the despair in the universe. Make it more personal. If you played through the DRK job quests, specifically the part where you confront yourself, that’s where I’m going with this. But on a global scale.

Still though, the idea that the universe is a cold lifeless place full of sorrow and despair resonated with me. It reminded me of the Dark Forest Theory. And it worked for me. As well as the relationship between Hermes and Meteion. It’s not for everyone, but It all worked for me, even if I would have done some things differently.

[Imakun]

To me EW felt like a very Final Fantasy experience.


Sudden and unexpected TRUE big bad? Check.
Spaceship? Check.
Feels and power of love? Check.
Time travel shenanigans? Check.
Kill gods? Check.


Sounds like FF to me.

I am very excited for the future, seeing the rest of the lands and realms on our planet and FINALLY being free from the shackles of 1.0 will be interesting.

[Lauront]

Then there's the other side. People who do nothing but criticize and pull apart every little thing as if its their sole purpose in life. I have a friend like this and I genuinely have to wonder if they enjoy anything at all. It's downright toxic behavior and its kinda miserable being around people like this.

Idea in meme format

The beauty of a forum, intended and designed to provide a venue for consumers of the product to discuss it, is you can simply ignore such posters if they're causing you "misery" through their "toxic" behaviour of expressing dissatisfaction for what is nothing more than a consumer product at the end of the day.

You don't know me. I don't accept whatever is put before me at all, which is why I left WoW after playing it the majority of my adult life. I think long time XIV players are just spoiled and anything less than perfection leads to whining.

But you're very quick to dismiss any conflicting opinions on the story as laughable, without specifying which complaints those might be, although I imagine the one you started out by quoting would be one such complaint, even though I thought it was very reasonably articulated.

I have played a plethora of games, including other MMOs - yes, even the much maligned WoW - and it is not failure to meet "perfection" here which is the issue at all. SHB was not perfect, and neither was HW.

Much as you reached a saturation point with WoW for its storytelling failures, some of us have come to a similar point with this game. That is all there is to it. Inability to comprehend this, feigned or otherwise, matters little to that.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

Look, people can like or dislike whatever they want. It just feels like these forums are always filled with such negativity. I understand being upset about the queues or if you didn't like a change to your class. And even though I can not comprehend anything less than adoration for this story, esepcially the last two thirds of it, I accept not everyone likes what I like. But that said, I see almost nothing but universal praise for the story in game. Almost every EW dungeon or trial and zone I entered, was filled with people exclaiming "OMG THIS AWESOME" and "I LOVE THIS ZONE" and "OMG THI IS STORY IS AMAZING".

Then I come to the forums...

[Rin_Kuroi]

I dont think anyone here is saying people cant enjoy things or the story. People are allowed to feel how they feel so your meme kind of falls flat for me. Maybe take your own advice and allow people to critique things if thats what they enjoy? Instead of trying to shut them up lmao. Since that is indeed what your meme is implying.

While I'm mostly talking about interpersonal communication between friends you do realize the toxic atmosphere this can create right? If all you do is criticize things others enjoy then there's a good chance those people won't want to be around you.

Do you understand the criticism I'm making here?

[Lauront]

Look, people can like or dislike whatever they want. It just feels like these forums are always filled with such negativity. I understand being upset about the queues or if you didn't like a change to your class. And even though I can not comprehend anything less than adoration for this story, esepcially the last two thirds of it, I accept not everyone likes what I like. But that said, I see almost nothing but universal praise for the story in game. Almost every EW dungeon or trial and zone I entered, was filled with people exclaiming "OMG THIS AWESOME" and "I LOVE THIS ZONE" and "OMG THI IS STORY IS AMAZING".

Then I come to the forums...

Let's say it is the case - I put that down to nothing more than dealing with a biased sample. 1) If you want to leave critical feedback of the game in the slim hope that it'll reach the devs, the forum is there for that, in contrast to the game where it will, in all probability, never be seen or heard by them. 2) It's reasonable to assume that, on average, people still actively playing the game are likelier to enjoy it, no? Granted, you can argue that the forum is a biased sample too, but I don't think it's an accident that you will encounter more critical feedback on it than you would in-game, simply by virtue of what it is and what it is designed to do.

[QT_Melon]

All of the final fantasy games have had major plot holes when you look at them close enough. Final Fantasy 4, 6 and 7 for sure did. It's just not the point of playing these games. It's the complete off the wall fantasy. The rule of cool. It's that's not your thing then fine. It's not like this is a mystery.

That's great and all - and we know This FF is a love letter to past ones. But those games were also old, so lets not hand wave it as an excuse for some of these issues with current writing. I don't think anyone was asking for they hyperbolic "Final Reality" but considering one of the major themes deals with a very heavy REALITY issue. I do feel that they could have tightened up those holes a bit better.

So let's not use past nostalgia as an excuse for people being a little more aware of writing issues in modern times.

[Lium]

Look, people can like or dislike whatever they want. It just feels like these forums are always filled with such negativity. I understand being upset about the queues or if you didn't like a change to your class. And even though I can not comprehend anything less than adoration for this story, esepcially the last two thirds of it, I accept not everyone likes what I like. But that said, I see almost nothing but universal praise for the story in game. Almost every EW dungeon or trial and zone I entered, was filled with people exclaiming "OMG THIS AWESOME" and "I LOVE THIS ZONE" and "OMG THI IS STORY IS AMAZING".

Then I come to the forums...

The forums suck, like they do with all video games. Social media sucks as well. I don’t white knight this game or any other, but forums have always been a culture of no. I have seen some amazing movies and TV shows, read amazing comics and novels and played some amazing video games. And then would go to a forum or subreddit to eagerly discuss it and discover EVERYONE hated it and is just ripping it apart. Sometimes I’m genuinely confused and think I’m on the wrong subreddit because this can’t possibly be the same movie I just saw.

So I take everything here with an enormous grain of salt. I thoroughly enjoyed Endwalker. It really hit me in a good way. And I can even single out a specific scene that nailed it for me.

Meteion standing in a field of flowers in a dead place surrounded by sorrow hearing Hermes’ voice. “I will gift to you a beautiful flower.” In the context of everything that’s happened, the Final Days that came to the Ancients, that came to various other worlds in the cosmos. All those dead civilizations. The Rejoinings and the pain the Ascians felt, trying to bring back their home. The staggering sense of loss in Ultima Thule, the dragons, the Ea, all awaiting death.

All of that suffering came down to that single moment, when Meteion remembered that beautiful flower.

It’s such a tragic moment. And that’s why I play this game.

[Rin_Kuroi]

So let's not use past nostalgia as an excuse for people being a little more aware of writing issues in modern times.

You understand these "writing-issues" are non-issues for other people? Nostalgia or not. If these "issues" are too much for you then I get it. However, part of media criticism is understanding the audience a piece of media is intended for. Final Fantasy isn't book 1 (or season 1 if were a tv show watcher) of Game of Thrones. That's not the kind of story its building here.