Summoner is a Final Fantasy 14 summoner (not a warlock wow clone)

[SieyaM]

alright let me break it down for seeing as you need some help (this is an example of condescending for future reference).

Anyone is allowed to enjoy a simple job, I don't care you do you. It doesn't make you less of an anything; it's just what you like. Having taken new SMN through the MSQ I can accurately say to anyone reading that there was no flexibility or effort to get to any part of the rotation. It was a flowchart of:
CDs>bahamut>titan>the others (this is your single point of variability/input, if you know the boss will move at a point don't put garuda there)>energy drain>phoenix>titan (if there are buffs up, otherwise doesn't matter)>the others>go to step 1
This was what you did every time, it was obviously what you did every time, it was what you did easily every time, and not doing the obvious+easy meant you were losing damage. It is for this reason I consider it to be a "clicking the blinking lights as they come up" job. I had a similar impression of dancer when I first tried it, but that job has much more room for optimization.

Let me break it down for you since you seem to need some help. Just like healers have been hearing for years, go play another job if you want something else, or even a different game if you want something that requires what I assume is your incredibly high IQ to play. The truth of the matter is that no job in this game has any flexibility, there is one rotation that you are meant to follow for every job without deviation, even the old summoner job.

[rewd]

Toxic casualism as its best. If something is not braindead, it has to be "tryhard", "hardcore" or "high IQ".

[aveyond-dreams]

The statement above speaks for itself. It comes as no surprise that those who keep calling a job "braindead" are being regarded by others as more elite-style players who are taking out their frustrations on people who just want to have some fun.

[tearagion]

Let me break it down for you since you seem to need some help. Just like healers have been hearing for years, go play another job if you want something else, or even a different game if you want something that requires what I assume is your incredibly high IQ to play. The truth of the matter is that no job in this game has any flexibility, there is one rotation that you are meant to follow for every job without deviation, even the old summoner job.

I will be playing another job, as summoner is no longer gratifying as was described in the post you didn't read.

The statement above speaks for itself. It comes as no surprise that those who keep calling a job "braindead" are being regarded by others as more elite-style players who are taking out their frustrations on people who just want to have some fun.

Please don't put words into peoples' mouths. Have your fun; I truly don't care what you enjoy or how you enjoy it and I don't think I'm better than anyone else because of the kind of job I enjoy. My qualm is that the jobs that I enjoy are gradually disappearing and I, as someone who has enjoyed this game for a long time, would like to keep enjoying it to a similar extent which in no small part hinges on jobs I enjoy existing.

[rewd]

Please don't put words into peoples' mouths. Have your fun; I truly don't care what you enjoy or how you enjoy it and I don't think I'm better than anyone else because of the kind of job I enjoy. My qualm is that the jobs that I enjoy are gradually disappearing and I, as someone who has enjoyed this game for a long time, would like to keep enjoying it to a similar extent which in no small part hinges on jobs I enjoy existing.

They are a well-known user around here. Trust me if I say don't bother.

[dinnertime]

I tried the new Summoner. I've been a SMN main since 2.x and here are my thoughts:

I love the job fantasy. It's basically what people have been asking for from the very beginning. Not only do you get to summon these impressive-looking entities more often, you get to borrow part of their power as your own. It fulfills a lot of what people hoped for the job.

However it is rather simple. One of the main reasons people play SMN was because it's a more complex job, but later on during Shadowbringers that complexity started to become more of an annoyance, then started to fade.
This redesigned SMN is pretty much a new job itself, completely different from the previous versions that essentially recycled assets.

People are upset because they've alienated a part of the SMN playerbase that enjoys this kind of gameplay. "Go play another job" is not very helpful advice to these people because (again) SMN was, if not the only job that offered more complex gameplay out of everything, and now that option is gone.

Personally? I'm not too bothered about the changes, but I'm not thrilled about the gameplay itself either. I'm still going to main the job but it's definitely not the job a lot of old players like myself remembered enjoying.

[Cithaerias_pyropina]

Gonna repeat myself ad infinitum. Lower the Elemental Mastery trait from Level from 86 to 78.

[UwuCat]

Summoner honestly reminds me of FF11 Summoner aloooooooot now.

In FF11 you would bring out a summon, Cast its damage ability and buffs/debuffs, de-summon it, summon a new one and repeat. Its almost carbon copy format now.

[Gallus]

Looks good. At last. I don't know what lack of depth is to some people, but if it is dealing with an unresponsive pet AI (remember Garuda's contagion? I do, and I don't miss it), Egi Assaults ghosting, Demis ghosting autoattacks or every fight requiring you to use the place command before pulling not to lose any uptime on Ifrit Egi? If that's the lack of depth we lack now I'm happy it is gone.

Some people calling this SMN braindead and not realizing there's actually quite a lot of room for optimization here. Ruby Ifrit is mostly the big offender in this rotation and the one that can mostly mess your flow, where you place him actually matters, a lot.

Not to mention, the new SMN can be very abusive with phase transitions because you are not required to use all the spells of a primal to jump onto another one, so say if you know there's a downtime coming you can go utterly wild with the 3 big attacks and skip many of the smallest ones. This screams flexibility to me, and when a job is flexible, it means it has a lot of room for optimization. So pretty much the opposite of what a lot of people are claiming here about "lack of depth".

From what I've noticed, it seems like single target Titan > Garuda > Ifrit but in AoE, funnily enough, it seems like Ifrit > Garuda > Titan.

The job requires more thought than you think, the difference is that optimizing it no longer requires dealing with extremely non-intuitive and glitchy commands/spells.

[zcrash970]

1. Bahamut/phoenix cd is based on on spell speed and not a strict 60cd. This allows both to drift out of 60sec and 120 buff windows that a party will provide

2. This even applies to our own buff, Searing Light. We will have to delay bahamut or delay the CD or we are waiting on both.

3. This points out the fault of carby. It hinders us severally. After every summon it returns to us so we need to position it every time we want to use searing light. Which can potentially delay our cd because carby is slow. As well depending on what summon you are using can be hetic to place carby

4. Phoenix is a dps loss for flavor and utility you cannot use when you need to

5. Ifrit design is weak for no reason and should technically be the strongest since we have to get it into melee range and two long casts. We are going to have to reserve swiftcast for this.

6. Summon animations can obscure visual mechanics.

7. Ruin 4 is very awkward and easily forgettable. It serves no point in our rotation outside of a pointless extra mobility option.

8. We have a ton of instant cast but nothing to fill the gap with. You get two festers that are immediately burned off in bahamut/phoenix

I can go on further about the leveling process and gameplay of the class if needed but I wanted to keep it focused on lvl90 issues. This is also precursory because I haven't really done my own math

The job requires more thought than you think, the difference is that optimizing it no longer requires dealing with extremely non-intuitive and glitchy commands/spells.

It really doesn't. What it boils down to is if you cant be in melee range don't use ifrit. If the target moving, don't use Garuda. Blow your big attacks if boss becomes un targetable anda demi will be off cooldown. That's not thinking, that's just not being an idiot