I appreciate Square Enix supporting LGBT rights in FFXIV.

[Angwa]

Normalization and humanization expressly is synonymous with validation. Are you actually serious right now?

Very much so, and no, they are most certainly not synonymous. Without diving too deeply into the technical/academic details and terminology and painting in very broad strokes they have different 'target-audiences':

Positive portrayals of minorities in the media can affect how others see them (normalization), but can also affect how they see themselves (validation). Which one you lean into, and how far you lean into it, not only dictates your primary audience, namely the community itself or everyone else and hence, obviously, also the communication itself. Those two goals can also definitely be at odds with each other.

As to the fine line between good representation and 'virtue-signaling', eh, who gets to be the judge? As I said above, so much depends on what you communicate, who you target with it and what your end-goal is.

One thing however I would be wary off, and that is ascribing political motives to the likes of corporate entities like Disney, Netflix etc, and more importantly, that this representation/virtue signaling is a negative. They just follow the money, and the money is currently in portraying diversity. Increasingly so even.

Corporate media definitely has an agenda when pushing representation, but as always, the main focus is simply our bank accounts. Apparently the market as whole is responding positively and not getting turned off, so we can expect this trend to grow.

Make of that what you will.

And as for children vs adults, the term you are looking for is young adult. You may object to this on a personal level, but in general the media targeting this group definitely deals with themes of love, identity, violence and sex.

[KizuyaKatogami]

Based upon all possible evidence for inference purposes, the community has chosen to see Ryne as somewhere between 15 and 16. To the developers she probably falls within this as well. This to most of the

I do agree with all of this, i just wanted to say i find it a bit…funny that the devs went on that tirade on not lewding the game npc’s etc etc especially the minors but then the very next patch came out with naked ryne and that outfit :x

[Bobby66]

Ignoring all this ambiguous subtext and claiming Ryne and Gaia are BFF's isn't crazy. Neither is picking it up and seeing a romance there. The only thing that is crazy in my opinion is denying the very fact that it is ambiguous and can be interpreted both ways, because, you know, whatever your personal take may be, the proof this goes beyond regular shipping discussions is just a google search away. This is after all hardly the only place and time this topic has come up.

So we can argue about whether SE intended Ryne and Gaia's story to be queer-coded, but there really is no point in denying that it is queer-coded.



The point of representation isn't to make anyone feel validated. It is to normalize and humanize. As everyone knows too many of us live somewhere where being lbgt+ means discrimination, persecution or even a death sentence. Representation won't magically fix this on its own, but positive portrayal or increased presence in media has been proven to increase acceptance and support for LGBT+ communities so it definitely matters. A lot.



Ok, orientation isn't sexuality, and romance neither.

Also, while an older lbgt couple in a wholesome and long-term relationship would definitely be nice, calling Ryne a child is ridiculous. Nobody treated her like one in the game, thankfully, because that would open a nasty can of worms. After all she was right there besides my WoL, armed with blades, facing powerful foes. You don't let a child do that. And nobody went looking for new foster-parents and a home when the Scions went back the Source, because, you know, she's old enough to take care of herself.

A young adult might apply, but definitely not a child. And there is plenty of media about young adults and relationships! Nothing icky about it.

I'm an adult! I swear!

[Ativan]

I'm an adult! I swear!

LGBT teens don't exist now?

[Ativan]

Very much so, and no, they are most certainly not synonymous. Without diving too deeply into the technical/academic details and terminology and painting in very broad strokes they have different 'target-audiences':

Positive portrayals of minorities in the media can affect how others see them (normalization), but can also affect how they see themselves (validation). Which one you lean into, and how far you lean into it, not only dictates your primary audience, namely the community itself or everyone else and hence, obviously, also the communication itself. Those two goals can also definitely be at odds with each other.

As to the fine line between good representation and 'virtue-signaling', eh, who gets to be the judge? As I said above, so much depends on what you communicate, who you target with it and what your end-goal is.

One thing however I would be wary off, and that is ascribing political motives to the likes of corporate entities like Disney, Netflix etc, and more importantly, that this representation/virtue signaling is a negative. They just follow the money, and the money is currently in portraying diversity. Increasingly so even.

Corporate media definitely has an agenda when pushing representation, but as always, the main focus is simply our bank accounts. Apparently the market as whole is responding positively and not getting turned off, so we can expect this trend to grow.

Make of that what you will.

And as for children vs adults, the term you are looking for is young adult. You may object to this on a personal level, but in general the media targeting this group definitely deals with themes of love, identity, violence and sex.

Thank you for this nuanced take.

[Bobby66]

LGBT teens don't exist now?

Person I quoted said they are an adult not teen. I am sorry a teen is not an adult not matter what they may personally feel. A teen often has more in common with a child in terms of mentality than an adult.

[Angwa]

Person I quoted said they are an adult not teen. I am sorry a teen is not an adult not matter what they may personally feel. A teen often has more in common with a child in terms of mentality than an adult.

The person you quoted actually said that she wasn't treated like a child and that the term young adult fits better. It's an actual term, like in 'young adult literature', etc.

Also, I don't really see what the point here is as arguing there is nothing between child and adult seems pretty silly? I mean, legally in most places 16+ means you are afforded a great deal more rights. Where I live, for example, drinking alcohol (no hard liquor though), have sex, make their own testament, have their own bank account their parents can't touch, decide medical stuff without parental consent and with privacy protection and a slew of other things as well. A great deal of other countries make a distinction between children and whatever you want to call them.

[Raeodor]

Why does everyone have to bring their crap from the real world into a fantasy world? And im talking to both sides.

[EaraGrace]

https://twitter.com/oomori_ff/status...806396418?s=21

[Lenivy]

Extremly important topic.