I appreciate Square Enix supporting LGBT rights in FFXIV.

[Lenivy]

If hypothetically one day say Yoshi-P says that yes, the relationship between Ryne and Gaia is indeed romantic in nature, does it really change any lore of FFXIV in any way or making it "murky"? Will it make any story beats we see during, before, or after Eden storyline become suddenly incoherent, because of that one change? In what why do you suggest that one change will make the lore/story incoherent?

Few thousand years old female who helped to kill her boyfriend and few millions but has body of a teen now shipped with kid with oracle powers and magical combat prowess. Seems right and dandy.

[KizuyaKatogami]

Few thousand years old female who helped to kill her boyfriend and few millions but has body of a teen now shipped with kid with oracle powers and magical combat prowess. Seems right and dandy.

Don’t forget the part where said kid with oracle powers has a fight where she strips naked and has a dragon run all over her body….yeah…

[Lenivy]

Don’t forget the part where said kid with oracle powers has a fight where she strips naked and has a dragon run all over her body….yeah…

I havent played shiva since forever but,yeah iforgot
Still, shipping few thousands years old ex genocide architect with a child oracle who hates said genocide architects is quite fun

[TaleraRistain]

That's actually why the storyline is so interesting and why it's even harder understand why people believe that Gaia and Ryne are a couple.
Gaia on an individual level is dealing with a madman who she doesn't remember trying to destroy everything her current self holds dear, herself included in his attempts to get back a previous version/reincarnation of herself.
Now that alone is conviction enough to defend yourself and warrant some self improvement but people prefer the alternative which is "She give me biscuit, I go now to flick bean!"

Completely agree. Gaia/Lohgrif choosing it for self-improvement is a much more interesting story for me than her doing it just for some other person.

[Ativan]

It is disheartening that people still think they're "just" friends.

[Exosapien]

"She give me biscuit, I go now to flick bean!"

The way the "anti-lgbt people" are so quick to reduce everything LGBT people are down to sex acts is really disturbing. That's literally all you think about, isn't it?

[SeverianLyonesse]

PT 1:

Okay, I have to clear up some misconceptions people have about the Ryne/Gaia story. While *yes* it was decidedly crafted in a manner so subtle that it can be passed off as platonic by those who don't care or don't look closely, it is pretty obviously a queer story. Let me point to two things breaking down authorial intent:

1) The soft confirmation: E12:

The final Eden fight has us reliving multiple memories between specifically Gaia and Ryne in an attempt to save her memories and self-identity. There are many ways to lampshade this as "the power of friendship," but when you pull back and look at stuff like the Tsukuyomi fight, several things emerge that make this kind of odd if that was what they were going for.

a) The Tsukuyomi fight uses a multifaceted approach to displaying its themes, running through Tsuyu's parents, brother, Zenos, and total strangers. Gaia's memories are specifically limited to her interactions with Ryne. If power of close friendship were the theme, they could have made it less focused on a singular person. Gaia is *fixated* on Ryne.
b) The memories the Eden fight takes you through are...pretty mundane and boring. Like...not very interesting scenes to watch or have replay (like grabbing coffee). They just aren't exciting from a "friendship" storytelling perspective. But if you view them as romantic scenes, suddenly they become more significant as not only more intimate, but memories that a person with romantic feelings would tend to focus on more.
c) The Tsukuyomi fight carries some pretty serious themes of abuse and trauma. Eden fight themes seem pretty lightweight (borderline insipid) by comparison when viewed through just a "friendship" lense. But make it a coming out story between for a woman with a history of self-identity issues and man problems (to find sanctuary in a relationship with a woman with a parallel history)...that's about on par with Tsuyu's story.

You couuuuuld still view this as just one of those really deep connections between platonic friends. But I would argue that:

a) The events we follow between the two friends are really, really boring writing for a video game if it is *just* about friendship.
b) Gaia is kind of hard to be friends with. The basis for their friendship is pretty thin unless you infer some element of physical attraction.
c) Again, the way Gaia's memories are written are oddly skewed to be *fixated* on Ryne to a degree more than friendship.
d) (Similarly, if we view all this from Ryne's perspective, she spends a LOT of time trying to bend over backwards and develop a relationship with Gaia, despite Gaia being kind of a bench and disinterested. I'm sure a lot of this is Ryne projecting her own insecurities and need for connection and trying to save people. But regardless of motivation, she does seem to develop a similar level of obsession.)

[SeverianLyonesse]

PT 2:

2) The Hard Confirmation: FF8 Ending:

I think many people trying to completely shut down this interpretation (aside from the low-key homophobes) either have not played through and appreciated FF8 in its entirety (easily the most ambitious and thematically rich writing in the entire series, even if it didn't always stick the landing) or simply completely missed the very clear parallels. The ending of the Eden raids is a shot for shot recreation of the FF8 ending where Squall realizes he loves Rinoa. There is absolutely no reason for the devs to do something so specific without intending to draw clear romantic parallels. Gaia is very clearly walking a stand-in for Squall, and Ryne is practically named the same as Rinoa. To anyone arguing that they are underage: Squall and Rinoa are both 17 in FF8 and their relationship is fairly chaste, just like Gaia's and Ryne's. It's young love.

The way I see it, the Eden raids are designed to be a sort of puzzle-box. You spend so much time watching this pretty underwhelming and frankly perplexing friendship between two people who seem pretty incompatible as friends, as well as the memory flashbacks. Wondering why and how this "friendship" is even working and why the writers are spending so much time on it. And then the final scene acts as the "aha!" moment (not just for the viewer, but for Gaia as well), where everything before is recontextualized and you realize that we were watching the beginnings of a relationship. It wasn't just coffee (which, I still hold if it was only coffee, probably the most useless plot arc in the whole game), it was a date.

And yeah, the plausible deniability remains for conservatives to ignore it. But I think this is one of the queerest stories a video game could tell without spelling it out for the viewer. I personally think it is possibly one of the most brilliant things the game has done, as good as the main SHB story and imo just a tad better than the fantastic Werlyt arc. Not only as a matter of very subtle writing, but for writing a queer couple realistically, making it about the little interactions and building toward common goals rather than hyperromanticizing or hypersexualizing it.

I understand if people get more from interpreting the story as a strong bond of friendship. I think creating spaces for very flamboyant platonic relationships is just as important as expanding LGBT recognition. But completely dismissing (and so caustically) what was pretty blatantly a queer-coded story I think speaks more to your level of literacy, empathy, and general level of social experience than whether the OP is trolling. Every day I see evidence that these forums are the gutters of the FF community.

Daddy Sev, out.

[HikaruToshizou]

I think it is weird you are seeing an underage girl and a person who lost their memories as love interests. I saw them only as good friends.

[SeverianLyonesse]

I think it is weird you are seeing an underage girl and a person who lost their memories as love interests. I saw them only as good friends.

Did you even read?

Rinoa was underage in FF8. So was Squall. Chaste, young love. Next.