Let's talk Dark Knights

[TheMightyMollusk]

Living Dead is fine in a group that knows what they're doing. In a PUG, it's a crapshoot whether the healers are paying attention and know what to do. Solo, it's delayed suicide, because DRK doesn't have enough self-healing to deal with it.

[Tranquilmelody7]

And it will stay unchanged, because it's a damn good CD.

Living Dead is fine in a group that knows what they're doing. In a PUG, it's a crapshoot whether the healers are paying attention and know what to do. Solo, it's delayed suicide, because DRK doesn't have enough self-healing to deal with it.

Living dead still only provides 9 seconds(AT BEST FFS) of actual mitigation while having a 60 second longer cooldown than Holmang, the best invulnerability skill in the gane.

All the downsides of Living Dead are for an extra 9 seconds to time the invulnerability for a death blow in high end content.
That sounds fair enough on paper, but it's not nearly practical enough to compensate for it's downsides even in highly coordinated groups.

Few deathly tankbusters in the game possess such stringent timing to facilitate the use of a buffer window.
Titania EX is the only I can think of off the top of my head that truly benefits from one.

If anything, I'd argue Living Dead encourages bad habits.
By getting used to the safety net provided by the Living Dead Window, you may neglect to actually time the invulnerability accurately - instead, shifting the bulk of the burden of timing mechanics to your healer while having them have to waste an unparalleled amount of healing resources than they would have to exhaust on any other tank.

With Endwalker, Warrior and Gunbreaker will have an significantly easier time timing their invulnerability skills properly for high end content, while DRK's pathetic excuse for a cooldown still has to worry about ending their mitigation window early.

Speaking of dungeons, pulling wall to wall will offer ample opportunities for tanks to utilize their invulnerability skills if the tank and healer cooperate to conserve their other resources during the activation of the skill.
Some tanks exercise the use of a macro to callout the activation period for invulns in advance for PUGs, which even Paladins should use so a healer doesn't waste a regen or shield on during their absolute invincible period.

Living dead is so utterly demanding of healing resources that you're better off not risking using to squeeze out an extra bit of optimization during runs, let alone as a panic button.

DRK is also the only tank that can't benefit from their invulnerability skill during solo play...I could go on...but many people have made it quite clear FOR YEARS just how aggravating Living Dead is.

It's bottom of the barrel gameplay design that cements it as not only my hated skill in FF14, but possibly any GAAS I've ever played.

The only positives I could sing Living Dead is that it looks cool.
Which is practically the thesis of DRK's entire design post HW and TBN.

[Liam_Harper]

Living Dead is fine in a group that knows what they're doing. In a PUG, it's a crapshoot whether the healers are paying attention and know what to do. Solo, it's delayed suicide, because DRK doesn't have enough self-healing to deal with it.

Even if the healer knows what to do in an organized group, if you use LD to immune tank busters you're either holding the WHM's best single target oGCD hostage or you're demanding a bunch of resources and/or GCD healing. Living dead is rubbish in any group, it's simply inferior to any other tank immune.

Invincible moves are used to cheese or make fights easier, but nothing in the actual game requires you to invu anything or it fails.

It's a piece of your toolkit. There are a lot of abilities in player toolkits that aren't absolutely necessary but are great because they make life easier if we utilize them well. The simple fact is that if 3 of 4 tanks have a powerful ability to handle tankbusters and the 4th tank has an inferior weaker version, that tank is comparatively worse off than the other tanks, even if they're "fine". A class can be viable but still bad.

[Gemina]

This was, in my opinion, the best explanation of a DRK I have seen so far.
Thank you for sharing/clearing this up. My lack of the English language prevented me from doing so.
Now I feel we both are correct from a certain point of view. In my case, it was more of a feeling I had from the experiences of playing a Death knight in WoW.

You would not keep small company in your views of DRK. The "evil" brand is part of their lore, but the DRK's themselves never consider themselves to be evil, and their methods are necessary for the greater good. Some say they lose their humanity to the abyss, and they would say, "If that is the cost to preserve justice, then so be it." They're very extreme, lol.

Even if the healer knows what to do in an organized group, if you use LD to immune tank busters you're either holding the WHM's best single target oGCD hostage or you're demanding a bunch of resources and/or GCD healing. Living dead is rubbish in any group, it's simply inferior to any other tank immune.

All tank invulns are inferior to Hallowed Ground. No ifs, ands, or butts about it. The devs need to finally realize that the tank invuln is a role skill. Please put it there and be done with this nonsense already.

[Tranquilmelody7]

And it will stay unchanged, because it's a damn good CD.

You would not keep small company in your views of DRK. The "evil" brand is part of their lore, but the DRK's themselves never consider themselves to be evil, and their methods are necessary for the greater good. Some say they lose their humanity to the abyss, and they would say, "If that is the cost to preserve justice, then so be it." They're very extreme, lol.


All tank invulns are inferior to Hallowed Ground. No ifs, ands, or butts about it. The devs need to finally realize that the tank invuln is a role skill. Please put it there and be done with this nonsense already.

Yes actually, there are if, ands, & butts.
Hallowed Ground has a cooldown of 420 seconds.

I'd take Holmang or Superbollide over it in almost any scenario save solo play.
The biggest advantage it had was that it had the longest duration of all the invulnerability skills, which will no longer be the case for Endwalker.

I understand hallowed ground could still very well be considered the overall best of the invulnerability skills due to having no drawbacks, but the gap between Living Dead and the rest in terms of of usefulness would still be far larger than Paladins invulnerability compared to the rest.

The last thing this game needs is more homogenization.
I'd much rather the 14 team NOT go the scorched earth approach when only one of 4 contemporary tank CDs has a genuine problem.

[Gemina]

The last thing this game needs is more homogenization.

Because why? When this word gets tossed around as much as it does, it sounds like an echo more than it does a valid argument. I don't see this to be the case of tank invuln skills in even the slightest. Trying to find niche ways for each tank to essentially do the same thing in this regard has got to be one of the biggest thorns in the side of this dev team. I never said Hallowed should stay at 420s, that within itself is ridiculous for any ability in this game. It would have to be adjusted to fit into a role skill, but it might as well be done at this point.

The invuln skill is very similar to tank LB3 as far as the intention behind its function, so there isn't much reason to try and find different ways to make it effective. If the devs made this choice, I am quite sure all kinds of players will be up in arms about it; but in the end they will adjust and everything will be just fine, and these silly arguments can finally be laid to rest.

[Larirawiel]

Because why? When this word gets tossed around as much as it does, it sounds like an echo more than it does a valid argument.

If you give every job everything then you could remove the jobs. Because why having jobs when there is no real difference between them? Tank, healer, magical DPS ans melee DPS would be enough.

Cheers

[LittleImp]

Because why? When this word gets tossed around as much as it does, it sounds like an echo more than it does a valid argument. I don't see this to be the case of tank invuln skills in even the slightest. Trying to find niche ways for each tank to essentially do the same thing in this regard has got to be one of the biggest thorns in the side of this dev team. I never said Hallowed should stay at 420s, that within itself is ridiculous for any ability in this game. It would have to be adjusted to fit into a role skill, but it might as well be done at this point.

The invuln skill is very similar to tank LB3 as far as the intention behind its function, so there isn't much reason to try and find different ways to make it effective. If the devs made this choice, I am quite sure all kinds of players will be up in arms about it; but in the end they will adjust and everything will be just fine, and these silly arguments can finally be laid to rest.

If the optimization of every single piece of content became completely job-agnostic, it would become extremely boring. Minor job and comp differences help to create more dynamic gameplay; The minor functional differences between invulns can be pretty important in spaces like Ultimate, as can their varied cooldowns.

[Izscha]

Because why? When this word gets tossed around as much as it does, it sounds like an echo more than it does a valid argument. I don't see this to be the case of tank invuln skills in even the slightest. Trying to find niche ways for each tank to essentially do the same thing in this regard has got to be one of the biggest thorns in the side of this dev team. I never said Hallowed should stay at 420s, that within itself is ridiculous for any ability in this game. It would have to be adjusted to fit into a role skill, but it might as well be done at this point.

The invuln skill is very similar to tank LB3 as far as the intention behind its function, so there isn't much reason to try and find different ways to make it effective. If the devs made this choice, I am quite sure all kinds of players will be up in arms about it; but in the end they will adjust and everything will be just fine, and these silly arguments can finally be laid to rest.

Let's delete everything beside PLD WHM DRG and BLM, you dont need all those useless jobs anyway so why bother ?

[linayar]

Let's delete everything beside PLD WHM DRG and BLM, you dont need all those useless jobs anyway so why bother ?

For different glamour and animations and general aesthetics, of course.