It's time to kill the argument that DPS abilities keep healers from healing.

[Drkdays]

This means nothing. It applies to any class on any game.

Yet you don't see neither tanks or dps reduced to 1 button spam.

At this point your just baiting.

You're *

And those other classes only worry about one role, not two.

Bazinga.

[GrimGale]

You're *

And those other classes only worry about one role, not two.

Bazinga.

Tanks worry about enmity, mitigation and boss positioning. Just take away all the damage abilities, let them keep an aoe and their ranged attack. Add more mitigation CDs.

See? Fixed it for the people who can't play good with the same logic than healers.

[Visanis]

You're *

And those other classes only worry about one role, not two.

Bazinga.

Tanks have to worry about proper self and party mitigation, boss placement, aggro for all mobs, etc on top of their own dps.

Dps have their own personal dps, proper combo execution, their own self and party mitigation (yes, dps have those too! Little known fact apparently) and positioning to worry about.

Damn that makes this game as a whole sound terrifying to the people you're claiming are the bread and butter of the healer crowd.

If I'm looking at it from your god awful deluded view, that looks like both tanks and dps are performing more than one role too, so they should be reduced to spamming 1 to cycle their combo like healers.

[Drkdays]

Tanks have to worry about proper self and party mitigation, boss placement, aggro for all mobs, etc on top of their own dps.

Dps have their own personal dps, proper combo execution, their own self and party mitigation (yes, dps have those too! Little known fact apparently) and positioning to worry about.

Healers worry about healing throughout the encounter while providing party protection. They also provide dps when possible and at their discretion while positioning to avoid mechanics.

There, fixed your summary of class responsibilities. Note that any class apart from dps classes have dps listed second and therefore less relevant. And each class has a kit specifically dedicated to its main role. Seems logical.

And yet, healer is the only class that should be equally dedicated to both according to the views in this forum? What if people don't want to do both? Or can't.

[GrimGale]

Tanks have to worry about proper self and party mitigation, boss placement, aggro for all mobs, etc on top of their own dps.

Dps have their own personal dps, proper combo execution, their own self and party mitigation (yes, dps have those too! Little known fact apparently) and positioning to worry about.

Healers worry about healing throughout the encounter while providing party protection. They also provide dps when possible and at their discretion while positioning to avoid mechanics.

There, fixed your summary of class responsibilities. Note that any class apart from dps classes have dps listed second and therefore less relevant. Seems logical.

We accept your concession

[Drkdays]

We accept your concession

You didn't read everything, Mr. Gale. That's an F for you.

[GrimGale]

You didn't read everything, Mr. Gale. That's an F for you.

Neither did you, apparently.

"Note that any class appart from dps have dps listed second and therefore less relevant."

Then why, oh, why do Tanks need that many damage options, why do they have rotations that involve more than 1 button? Just give them the same kit as healers do, after all DPS is secondary for a Tank right?

What if, in your own words, Tanks only want to "Tank" and not dps? They can hold enmity by spamming Unmend, Shield Lob, Tomahawk and Lightning Shot. In AoE they can hold enmity with their respective multitarget buttons. Tanks don't even need to damage a target to hold enmity. Just fix it so you can spam Provoke and Ultimatum. Who needs damage as a Tank as long as you have plentiful mitigation buttons.

[Drkdays]

Neither did you, apparently.

"Note that any class appart from dps have dps listed second and therefore less relevant."

Then why, oh, why do Tanks need that many damage options, why do they have rotations that involve more than 1 button? Just give them the same kit as healers do, after all DPS is secondary for a Tank right?

What if, in your own words, Tanks only want to "Tank" and not dps? They can hold enmity by spamming Unmend, Shield Lob, Tomahawk and Lightning Shot. In AoE they can hold enmity with their respective multitarget buttons. Tanks don't even need to damage a target to hold enmity. Just fix it so you can spam Provoke and Ultimatum. Who needs damage as a Tank as long as you have plentiful mitigation buttons.

Simple, because tanks, just like dps, JUST LIKE HEALERS, need a variety of abilities to handle a variety of possibilities to reliably fulfill their MAIN role.

Also, you said same kit as healers get, by which I assume you mean their dps kit alone, but healers do have more than one dps ability. Something everyone seems to forget or just plain disregard. WHM has five dps abilities at 80 in fact...about half as many direct healing abilities they have. So they do already have a strong dps kit, but without complicated rotations so that if a healer does decide to assist it can be as low stress as possible, which strongly implies a lack of forcefulness on SE's part.

[GrimGale]

Simple, because tanks, just like dps, JUST LIKE HEALERS, need a variety of abilities to handle a variety of possibilities to reliably fulfill their main role.

Your words not mine.

[GrimGale]

Also, you said same kit as healers get, by which I assume you mean their dps kit alone, but healers do have more than one dps ability. Something everyone seems to forget or just plain disregard. WHM has five dps abilities at 80 in fact...about half as many direct healing abilities they have.

Yes. We have more than 1 DPS ability, that's true.

1 Spammable nuke. 1 Dot. 1 AoE Spammable. 1 oGCD ( Which in WHM case its also a heal. Assize every 45s). And 1 Movement tool. They are all context dependent of course, you won't use your AoE when there is only one target, you won't use your movement tool when there is no movement. You will use mostly your Nuke, upkeep your Dot and use your oGCD as much as you can. That usually means use your Nuke 12 times, refresh your dot and every so other cycle weave your oGCD in.

You're a Dark Knight main. How many abilities that are not exclusively "mitigation" or have "increased enmity" do you use regularly?

Why do you need Darkside? Why do GNB need the continuation combo? Why do WAR need Inner release or PLD their magic combo? Why do they need Fight or Flight, No mercy or Delirium? Those aren't tank buttons.