The questions I want EW to answer the most: WHY and HOW was the world sundered?

[Cleretic]

This is exactly why I don't want Hydaelyn to turn out evil. We've done that plot over and over.

It's far more interesting to do something else with the idea for once.

Yeah, at this point I think the only games I can think of that don't eventually lead to you fighting the goodboy light-god are, like... Legend of Zelda games. Maybe some Fire Emblems.

C'mon, contend with Nintendo, let's keep Hydaelyn unambigously good instead of collapsing into cliche.

[Cilia]

The "subverting the cliché of a benevolent god by having them turn out to actually be evil" has been so overdone it's a cliché in and of itself now. There's nothing wrong with playing it straight.

I just don't have the inclination to argue minutiae anymore, and there's no profit in arguing against ideas that "can't be disproven / ruled out."

I actually quite like Hydaelyn's status as a deceitful and manipulative but ultimately benevolent force in the world. I think it's much more interesting than having her be either absolutely good and perfect or insidious and nefarious.

[waifugenerator]

Zodiark and Hydaelyn will probably just straight up be similar to Spiritus/Materia from the later Dissidia titles, deceitful and petty but ultimately benevolent gods in conflict with each other

[WhiteArchmage]

Zodiark and Hydaelyn will probably just straight up be similar to Spiritus/Materia from the later Dissidia titles, deceitful and petty but ultimately benevolent gods in conflict with each other

As much as Dissidia NT had pretty bad gameplay, Spiritus and Materia are pretty good additions to the series. The game tries to fool you into thinking they're just Cosmos and Chaos with a different coat of paint, but they're both equally necessary for the World of Conflict. In the World of Respite of Opera Omnia, it's even more interesting as they have very different ideals of what constitutes "respite", but in both games they both mean well, even if their nature is to be at odds with one another.

What does this mean for Hydaelin and Zodiark? I don't know. We could end up finding a balance between them, and have them merge into a single entity, or keep them as separate entities but with enough of the other to have a measure of "stability".

...Is it the 19th, yet?

[Vyrerus]

But at that point, there are other factors in play. We are in the aetherial sea and Minfilia is channeling the power of a powerful aetherial being. And from memory she halts the axe mid-swing – acting on the object directly rather than the mind of the wielder.

She acts on Ardbert, not the axe. His swing is stopped with energy coursing around his entire upper body, acting on the wielder, not the weapon.

As far as Hydaelyn goes... I don't think she's evil. I think their intent with her is a sorrowful being, doing what must be done. Or at least, what she thinks must be done.

[Mansion]

Yeah, at this point I think the only games I can think of that don't eventually lead to you fighting the goodboy light-god are, like... Legend of Zelda games. Maybe some Fire Emblems.

C'mon, contend with Nintendo, let's keep Hydaelyn unambigously good instead of collapsing into cliche.

I think what most games have tackled is that "unambiguously good" is impossible. Because "good" isn't the same for everyone. And these Gods have always been favouring what they thought was right, in detriment of the rest.
In FFXIV's case, we already have a bad boy like that, it's Thordan. He was an embodiment of "the good" for most people in Ishgard. And he thought we were the evil one for stopping him.

Hydealyn's case would be similar. The good for humans... right, but tall humans don't have the same aspirations (Garlemald vs Eorzea vs the New World maybe). And is it the same definition for beast-men? I also think she is benevolent in essence, but I wouldn't be surprised if she had to make choices or actions that would be unfair to some people, and that us WoL would question at some point.
That's why the concept of one/greater god in RPGs is always ambivalent I believe.

But there's a lot for Endwalker to cover so I won't think too deep about it. Tempered or not, it doesn't matter so much in the end in my opinion

[Iscah]

She acts on Ardbert, not the axe. His swing is stopped with energy coursing around his entire upper body, acting on the wielder, not the weapon.

Okay, physical control of the person. But tempering is mental control in (as far as I can remember) every definite case we've seen.

[Veloran]

There's also something to remember about the whole situation from Azem's presumed angle: since their last known presence, the Convocation have shifted into becoming planet-destroying genocidal monsters on an unfathomable scale, while Hydaelyn's been spending all that time trying to get them to knock it off. I think it's folly to assume that Azem wouldn't be realigning their expectations over the years, and if they had a say I think it's perfectly reasonable for them to look at Hydaelyn and go 'you know what, I didn't much like you, but the other guys went crazy, we need to get them to stop before anything else'.

For all intents and purposes, the Ascians are already done for. Sure there are still a few sundered hangers-on, but basically the "before anything else" has already come and gone. Additionally, Hydaelyn herself is a Primal that destroyed the planet, so...

This is exactly why I don't want Hydaelyn to turn out evil. We've done that plot over and over.

It's far more interesting to do something else with the idea for once.

Even if we want to say that "the JRPG party must destroy the god that was seemingly on their side throughout the story" has turned into a cliché, the opposite is also still a cliché.

We have no information about her intentions at this point. It could be deliberate or it could be a horrendous accident that happened when she was trying to sunder Zodiark alone but he was too intertwined with the world itself.

She was formatted with the ability to sunder things in that extremely specific way, not to mention the ability to set up a dimensional barrier between the worlds preventing them from rejoining. I don't believe for a moment that it was simply an accident, it was by design and the original sundered world was the state of being Venat planned for.

Yeah, at this point I think the only games I can think of that don't eventually lead to you fighting the goodboy light-god are, like... Legend of Zelda games. Maybe some Fire Emblems.

C'mon, contend with Nintendo, let's keep Hydaelyn unambigously good instead of collapsing into cliche.

As I said, Hydaelyn staying in that position is already a cliché of it's own. And frankly, one which doesn't address all the issues with her that have been building in the story for years. At this point going the route of "she was just misunderstood and actually is unambiguously good and helps you out to the very end" would simply be subverting a subversion for the sake of being meta-subversive. It simply reverts us to the state of play we had way back in 2.0. Again, I fail to see what this would actually add to the narrative, not to mention the story of Endwalker specifically.

Are we really supposed to believe that Endwalker will just be Stormblood 2.0 with few, if any, twists and moral dilemmas along the way? We just go to the moon to kill Zodiark, and chase down Zenos and Fandanny before killing the former with Hydaelyn's blessing? That at the end of the Hydaelyn/Zodiark saga that's spanned five expansions we just end up viewing both of them practically the same way we did at the end of ARR?

[Iscah]

Even if we want to say that "the JRPG party must destroy the god that was seemingly on their side throughout the story" has turned into a cliché, the opposite is also still a cliché.

I don't feel like "cliché" is the right word when it's just a thing established at the start of the story that holds true at the end.

And how many instances are there of "the being we thought was our mother-goddess is actually an artificial construct we may need to destroy – but actually she's still good and does genuinely care about us and want the world to be in a good state"?

Has that happened enough to become cliché?

[kaynide]

I'm at work, and the post is several hours old, but... *clinks coffee cup to your booze cup* Próst!

I like both of these ideas, as they've flitted through my head as well. Honestly I think my brain is just spun up with excitement that just starts pouring out this sort of stuff because it wants Endwalkies now. Plus, I like guessing at what comes next.

Cheers!

Yeah, it's fun to just shoot for wild ideas. I don't honestly care if any of them actually happen- it's not like I need to prove that I'm the Alpha Nerd or whatever. It's just fun to go down rabbit holes.

As far as current talk.. yeah I really hope Hydaelyn doesn't turn out evil. I wouldn't mind seeing Zodiark turn out to be a misunderstood-but-not-evil character.. but I would be disappointed if Hydaelyn turned out to be some "Twist" boss.

I think at worst, I would be cool with a "If we destroy Zodiark, it means destroying Hydaelyn". Or even some kind of Dark Crystal thing where they are actually 1 entity that was sundered.