"gogogo" might make me quit this game.

[aveyond-dreams]

Yeah, the go go go thing is terrible. As a healer main, I refuse to run dungeons unless I know the tank personally. It really sucks on days when I cannot get a friend to tank, because I miss out on roulettes, but I am forced to make that choice because of tanks that think they can tank entire maps and DPS that think they are tanks, then they turn around and blame me for their deaths...

Thing is, a competent tank probably can tank an entire map in post-50 content and a dps pulling ahead will not kill them as long as the tank takes aggro. If as a healer main you don't know how to keep a tank doing w2w alive, I have to question your understanding of your abilities.

[Jirah]

Ima point out that besides the initial run, you never have to do the dungeon again. Want tomes theirs like 7 other roulettes you can do. 3 of which are trial alternatives and 1 being a glorified solo instance.

The 4 of them, trials, raid trials and 24 man, and MSQ is more than enough for caps for the week. Also get a gripe, dungeons in 80s hardly requires any real critical thought and your just slowing down the group if you decide that more than 3 mobs is too much, which unless your doing leveling dungeons 71-79 or the ARR minilvl, Your hindering the parties progress by slowing them down. Either change to a job that has no responsibilities like a DPS, or don’t do dungeons.

A argument can be made that the mobs need to be more of a threat but this would just piss off the people that want a on-rails and non threatening experience in high 90s content. To that I say “just do trusts, don’t water out the content for everyone”

[Jennah]

You're right. Gogo is a terrible character. So much potential with being able to customize his abilities, knowing all the magic the party knows, and 'Mimic'.
But his abyssmal stats - and complete inability to raise them with Espers! - means that while he can do anything, he'll do it pretty terribly.

... wait, is that not what we were complaining about?

[Nishira]

We should be encouraging people to improve rather than holding others back to accommodate fears.
And fears of what even? Wipes don't exactly set you back much like they do in other games. The entire game is based on "learn though failure" when it comes to raids anyway.

It’s not necessarily fear tho. For me personally it’s partly an intense dislike of having to rush. I dislike timers for the same reason, it promotes a sort of frenzied gameplay that I find off-putting. That doesn’t automatically equate dawdling around (tho I have zero issues with that, I’m very patient lol), it just means I like a pace that feels efficient but calm.

I’m not saying btw everyone should feel like I do. Or that every run should go the way I prefer it to. I fully understand others have run content a million times and may prefer a quicker pace and I’ll of course adjust respectfully when necessary. But I find it quite telling this same respect is seemingly not returned in these kind of discussions. Rushing at max speed is, and should be, the norm and any deviating from that is BAD instead of taking away from discussions like these that some people really don’t enjoy it and therefore maybe the speed of a run should depend on more factors.

In game I find this much less the case btw, most people I’ve met in DF were chill and just went with the flow.

[RitsukoSonoda]

It’s not necessarily fear tho. For me personally it’s partly an intense dislike of having to rush. I dislike timers for the same reason, it promotes a sort of frenzied gameplay that I find off-putting. That doesn’t automatically equate dawdling around (tho I have zero issues with that, I’m very patient lol), it just means I like a pace that feels efficient but calm.

I’m not saying btw everyone should feel like I do. Or that every run should go the way I prefer it to. I fully understand others have run content a million times and may prefer a quicker pace and I’ll of course adjust respectfully when necessary. But I find it quite telling this same respect is seemingly not returned in these kind of discussions. Rushing at max speed is, and should be, the norm and any deviating from that is BAD instead of taking away from discussions like these that some people really don’t enjoy it and therefore maybe the speed of a run should depend on more factors.

In game I find this much less the case btw, most people I’ve met in DF were chill and just went with the flow.

Part of the cause of this rushing mentality is the lack of difficulty or danger in most 4 player duties that resulted from over simplification of general 4 player duties to be essentially a linear corridor, and the players being over geared due to rapid power creep via ilvl. The latter part of that may not be so much of an issue when Endwalker launches since they're removing belts as a gear slot and are supposedly cutting stat gains on lv 50+ ear to only have about 20% of what they currently have now. However that also depends on how they rebalance the duties from lv 50+. I would hope we'll finally start seeing some more interesting dungeon designs in Endwalker. However if that isn't the case then atleast throw in more of those enemy types that can cause problems. A couple examples being those frogs that cast the buff that makes an enemy grow and become more powerful. Bees/wasps because final sting sucks when you pull a bunch of enemies and your DPS doesn't prioritize getting rid of them before they suicide poke the tank. Maybe have more enemies that either explode painfully when they die or do some kind of death throes effect that buffs the remaining enemies around it when it dies? Oversized enemies that can fall on you when they die doing damage? I only mention that last one because I'm recalling a few times in other games I played where I found myself giggling because someone got killed by a large monster or boss falling on them when it died.

[TaleraRistain]

If we've got a newbie watching a cutscene, I stick with them outside the arena. If those who ran in can survive without heals until we get there, great. We'll join them when the cutscene is done or the game pulls us in. If not, then they can enjoy the walk of shame back and hopefully have learned something about manners.

[Anienai]

and maybe some of you are fine with that.

Just say, "I'm not sure what I did wrong, but I'll go if that's what you want." Drop the group and eat the penalty. I've done this from time to time.


*Side note*
Wawa french fries are awesome.

[Daeriion_Aeradiir]

Maybe it's harder to do on console?

Not even close to hard.

Select, Select, X/A/whatever. Done, you're in the loot menu in < 1 second. I play on controller as tank, open up chests the nanosecond the boss dies and get my lots done on loot within the time it takes to reach the first pack after the boss. It's all about learning how to menu properly.

[Karthunk]

We have done the same dungeon 300 times, we don't want to go slow.

[Guilty_Mithra]

The game is built and designed for wall to wall pulls. You can not like it, but that's your problem with the game, not your problem with other players. The game is explicitly designed and balanced so that you're supposed to pull everything possible. You can't argue this when even -that- is completely lacking in challenge, and pulling single packs or even doubles is enough to put people to sleep.

I would rather things not be like that. I would prefer each pack to be intimidating and dangerous. I would rather the game put CC abilities back into the game and add more. I would rather take non-boss enemies seriously. But the reality is, they're nothing more than HP-based progress bars to delete so I can move on with my daily routine. They will never be a challenge until SE decides they should be. Dungeons are and (seemingly) will always be brainless "mash muh AOE combos" fiesta, with some interesting bosses, beautiful scenery, and great music to make it worthwhile.

As for people being "selfish", I see people using that word incorrectly. If an entire group wants to rush through a dungeon, but one person does not, THAT person is being selfish.

If someone says "hey I'm not comfortable tanking big packs yet", it depends. If we're in the 30s or so, then sure, I totally get it. But if you're level 70+ and you say you're feeling nervous, then I'm not sure what to tell you. You either level boosted (at which point it's on you to catch up skill wise Right Now, which is easy), or maybe tanking just isn't for you.

As for cutscenes, eh. I just do whatever the group does. If someone just goes ahead and pulls the boss, I'm going in and I'll keep everyone alive if the healer decides to stay out. I don't care if someone watches the cutscene, but neither am I going to really care if they miss the first 15-20 seconds of the boss fight that they'll see another 500 times.