With some Jobs play style completely changed, isn't it time for alternate job specs?

[Jojoya]

Even if players who want this "difficult to play and master, but rewarding" job like 4.2 Monk and 5.1 Summoner was are a minority... that minority are still players of the game and shouldn't be ignored.
Making a job for them does not hurt the other players who enjoy these more streamlined and easy to play job reworks. 2% of players wanting something like this is still tens of thousands of players.

What pay off are you expecting for the "difficult to play and master" jobs/specializations you're suggesting?

SE isn't going to reward them with increased throughput when they want every job to be viable and included at end game.

Players would be more likely to exclude those who want to use the "difficult to play and master" specs because there's no way to tell you've actually mastered them sufficiently without resorting to third party tools. Sure, some players would look. Most wouldn't bother.

Something like WoW's Mage Tower would probably be needed to provide the rewards you seek, unless maybe the "difficult to play and master" part was designed with Deep Dungeon solos in mind.

For truly challenging combat design, you're better off going to a game that caters to a hardcore niche crowd than a MMO that has to appeal to a much broader audience.

[Oshirigami]

No, you said there should be a spec for it to have dots, since its basically a new job. My point had nothing to do with difficulty of the job, its rotation, or mechanics. And only that maybe they'll make a DoT job since SMN is now a traditional FF SMN.

Plus, I wasn't quoting the OP, but a different post you made in the thread.

You're deliberately refusing to read not just what I wrote in the original post, but the very post you're quoting there which was just 3 sentences, in order to strawman, where I said ... the entire post there.

I said there should be difficult jobs after the complex ones are over-simplified. There's just going to be BLM left after this, which really isn't as difficult as people make it out to be and even so people who want difficult jobs to master might not like that play style (as I don't).

What pay off are you expecting for the "difficult to play and master" jobs/specializations you're suggesting?

SE isn't going to reward them with increased throughput when they want every job to be viable and included at end game.

That's clearly wrong or else they would have nerfed Summoner in 5.5. It is the difficult to play and master ranged job that gets the extra payoff of having a revive and party damage buff on top of doing top tier selfish DPS that's right up there with BLM and SAM.

Square has clearly deemed it worthy to have high damage due to the difficulty despite it also having utility in a party damage buff and rez compared to what RDM has in 5.5.

[ItMe]

That's clearly wrong or else they would have nerfed Summoner in 5.5.

There are many reasons they could have chosen not to nerf SMN in 5.5. It could have been left as is because

- expac is ending and its more hassle than its worth to fix it with a big rework coming, especially since none of the fixes will likely inform the rework.

- 6.0 is right around the corner and maybe the battle team staff just didn't have time.

- They see it as a problem, but not a problem that's hurting anyone. So SMN is a bit overtuned for PvE, what's that gonna do, make the Savage runs your overgeared for even easier? Best to just leave it if it isn't causing problems.

- Maybe they have different data that doesn't show SMN as overperforming and they just don't see the situation the same way you do.

- etc.

They didn't do anything to SMN in 5.5... but that alone doesn't give us enough info to "confirm" anything.