Who is your least favorite major character and why?

[kaynide]

This thread is kinda proof NA and EU prefers deep/sympathetic villains.
Kinda a shame really. I love zenos because he's simple and knows what he wants. He's just that simple baddie of old.
I don't mind villains with some kinda deep motivation like emet but it gets tiresome and its nice to have someone like zeno's who's just pure evil for the sake of it and we have to defeat.

It's not that I particularly hate Zenos, I just dislike the ridiculous plot armor he has. People can hate Y'shtola all they want, but we actually killed Zenos the man, then Zenos the primal, then Zenos the possessed.

I don't really care anymore for him, but for him to work at this point there needs to be major plot/lore dumps to explain him. Like is he becoming a Neo-Ascian with many "shards" collected like the WoL? What about his soul is so different from others who have done similar things (like Papalymo or Ysayle)?

Additionally, his motivation (as far as we know) is to stave off boredom. I mean..sure.. but.. ehhh. I would have preferred if he was just a serial killer/psycho who enjoyed killing and actually had plans/machinations/designs towards killing us... something like a Bond villain. He's just bored and sitting around. Real-World, theoretically with the tech available we could just nuke him from orbit because he's not actually doing anything towards his goal- it's all Fandaniel.

I guess that's the problem- I just don't feel any threat from him like I did with..say.. Nidhogg.

[Yencat]

Additionally, his motivation (as far as we know) is to stave off boredom. I mean..sure.. but.. ehhh. I would have preferred if he was just a serial killer/psycho who enjoyed killing and actually had plans/machinations/designs towards killing us... something like a Bond villain. He's just bored and sitting around. Real-World, theoretically with the tech available we could just nuke him from orbit because he's not actually doing anything towards his goal- it's all Fandaniel.

This is why I kind of enjoy Fandaniel more at the moment, as crazy as he is (or seems to be) there's actually a bit of character and charisma there.

Hopefully it changes a bit in Endwalker but Zenos' whole thing right now is sitting around being a bored, snoozy boy and every now and then slow-walking with his hip pads on and it's just not fun to watch.

[StriderShinryu]

This is why I kind of enjoy Fandaniel more at the moment, as crazy as he is (or seems to be) there's actually a bit of character and charisma there.

This is a good point, and I agree completely with it. Zenos alone is bad and boring, but Zenos next to Fandaniel actually just makes Zenos even worse. There's nothing at all wrong with a psychotic villain who just wants to see the world burn. Heck, Kefka is one of the most beloved FF villains of all time and he wasn't exactly much deeper than that. Fandaniel is over dramatic and clearly unhinged. He's actually fun, and fun to hate especially given the body he's using. He just wants everything to end, which actually ends up being a nice counterpoint to both Emet and Elidibus. Plus, having an Ascian who may be less powerful but is not really restricted by the sort of rules and laws Emet and Elidibus played by is another bonus.

So, do we need a villain with some major, relatable back story that we empathize with? No, we don't. But if you're going to give us an inhuman villain that clearly doesn't care about any rules of morality then at least make them fun and interesting. Make them someone we actually want to see beaten and ground into the dirt. We already have that... in Fandaniel.

[Kolsykol]

This thread is kinda proof NA and EU prefers deep/sympathetic villains.
Kinda a shame really. I love zenos because he's simple and knows what he wants. He's just that simple baddie of old.
I don't mind villains with some kinda deep motivation like emet but it gets tiresome and its nice to have someone like zeno's who's just pure evil for the sake of it and we have to defeat.

I think it's moreso that people like villains/ characters that makes them *feel* smart.
It's quite evident looking at AAA gaming and what games are held up as these great narrative masterpieces.
It's mostly pretty shallow where '' sad '' equates to brilliant and deep and where production value carries it super ultra hard.

Obviously not saying that FFXIV haven't had deep villains but moreso that I think a lot of people like *only* villains with big speeches about '' deep '' issues or who are sad dads etc because of how they make them feel.
There's a certain level of snobbery a lot of people have about this where they unironically act embarrassed to like something '' stupid '' and where taking something and making it '' less fun '' and more sad makes it '' more grown up ''.
I remember when Code Vein and DMC5 were coming out for example and there were articles coming out where journalists were essentially trying to prove to people and their collegues how very aware they were that they were '' stupid games '' and to please not judge them for having enjoyed them.

A lot of Japanese games with genuinely deep characters get shoved aside because the presentation is a bit wacky and Japanese too.
Ultimately I think that the interest of a lot of people when it comes to this is very shallow and more about some wanting to feel like what they're spending their time on is important and has some kind of a meaning but that's all there is.

[Nightingaile]

I think it's moreso that people like villains/ characters that makes them *feel* smart.
It's quite evident looking at AAA gaming and what games are held up as these great narrative masterpieces.
It's mostly pretty shallow where '' sad '' equates to brilliant and deep and where production value carries it super ultra hard.

Obviously not saying that FFXIV haven't had deep villains but moreso that I think a lot of people like *only* villains with big speeches about '' deep '' issues or who are sad dads etc because of how they make them feel.
There's a certain level of snobbery a lot of people have about this where they unironically act embarrassed to like something '' stupid '' and where taking something and making it '' less fun '' and more sad makes it '' more grown up ''.
I remember when Code Vein and DMC5 were coming out for example and there were articles coming out where journalists were essentially trying to prove to people and their collegues how very aware they were that they were '' stupid games '' and to please not judge them for having enjoyed them.

A lot of Japanese games with genuinely deep characters get shoved aside because the presentation is a bit wacky and Japanese too.
Ultimately I think that the interest of a lot of people when it comes to this is very shallow and more about some wanting to feel like what they're spending their time on is important and has some kind of a meaning but that's all there is.

I would say that it's moreso that I like my characters to be more like... actual people. Not tropes of anime protagonists and antagonists. Real people do not have only one motivation. Real people are not just "evil" or "good".

If I wanted to see characters with tropes, I'd pick up and watch any of the generic anime I watched back when I was in High School. It was fine for me then, but now I've seen it dozens and dozens of times and I don't know how Japanese storytelling keeps getting away with it. It has become an exercise in eye-rolling.